Help me become free

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BeHereNow
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Help me become free

Postby BeHereNow » Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:02 am

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this?
I am starting to see that I will need to overcome any thoughts of there being a permanent self that will have a particular purpose or way in life. I am constantly consumed by trying to make sense of this idea that there is no self, but I think that ultimately no inherent self means getting comfortable with the fact that we are a part of everything

What are you looking for at LU? I would like to settle into the reality of no self, to really feel it and experience it, to find ways to live my life from this place. I would like to let go of concepts around no self and being present and instead get to experience being fully present and dissolve my constant preoccupation with myself, my thoughts and my path.

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
I hope to see through the ways in which I continue to get stuck in the false self, and find a path to direct inquiry into the present moment. I hope to learn how to do this first through a guided conversation so I can do it more and more on my own, and ultimately live a free life.

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?
have been meditating and doing yoga for over 10 years. I am currently enrolled in a yoga therapist program. I have been on a 10 day and other retreats, and once had the experience of completely dissolving and feeling like I was the tree I was looking at. This was so real it has never left me! I look forward to making this state of openness and curiosity a more permanent part of my life.

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self? 11

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adilerten
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Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Thu Mar 07, 2019 10:48 am

Hello
My name is Adil and i am a guide here.

We can start the journey if it is okay for you.

If you feel ready send me a message and tell me how would you like me to call you "if it its not behereanow" :)


Sending much love
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

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BeHereNow
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Re: Help me become free

Postby BeHereNow » Thu Mar 07, 2019 2:39 pm

Hi Adil,

Happy to begin! I am Paula.

Looking forward to the journey 😊

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adilerten
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Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Thu Mar 07, 2019 4:00 pm

Hi Paula

Before we start i would like to share some tips to make our
dialogue smooth and effective:

1. Please write as much as you can; I would advise you to
write at least once a day, in order to keep it fresh and buid a momentum.

2. Our main focus here is on seeing through the illusion of
what we call "I," "me," or "self." Please set aside all the teachings
you've learned from books, retreats, youtube, and so on, for the sake
of not bringing bias to what we'll do during our conversation.

3. Process will be mostly answering my questions, its best efficiant if you may answer them one
by one..Please be always 100% honest with your answers
Don't choose the "right." answer, from "what comes up" There's no one here to judge or critisise.
If you are stuck with any issue, we can always take a close look at it.

4-set aside all other spiritually related materials (books, videos etc.) so that you can completely focus on your own direct experience.

5-Here's a link that shows how to use the quote function: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fAToDNh9hQ[/

6- I would suggest you read "What Liberation Unleashed is not" from this link http://www.liberationunleashed.com/about/faq/#faq-1041

If all ok let's start
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

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adilerten
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Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Thu Mar 07, 2019 4:07 pm

as i usually do i want to start with expectations,

Dear "Paula"

Can you tell me what is your expectations ? What do you think will happen ?
What is missing ?
What should be any different ?



(Remember blue marked lines are always going to be my questions in our dialogue)

Thank you

Sending love
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

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BeHereNow
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Re: Help me become free

Postby BeHereNow » Fri Mar 08, 2019 2:14 am

Expectations - I expect to Havel glimpses of losing my constant preoccupation with myself, my life, my next steps.

To have moments of peace.

I hope to be able to become more and more free of judging myself and others and help others to do the same.

What will happen - I don’t know. Perhaps moments of clarity?

Missing - a sense of trust, of flow, of love, of knowing things are already ok and I don’t need to try so hard.

Different - only my attachment to wanting things to be different. To be doing what I love and getting paid for it, for my son to be less difficult, for me to be less angry.

Maybe I just watch all of this and nothing needs to be different... I know that intellectually but it just makes me sad.

Letting things be as they are makes me feel sad, like I’m not enough.

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adilerten
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Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Fri Mar 08, 2019 3:07 pm

Expectations - I expect to Havel glimpses of losing my constant preoccupation with myself, my life, my next steps.

To have moments of peace.

I hope to be able to become more and more free of judging myself and others and help others to do the same.

What will happen - I don’t know. Perhaps moments of clarity?

Missing - a sense of trust, of flow, of love, of knowing things are already ok and I don’t need to try so hard.

Different - only my attachment to wanting things to be different. To be doing what I love and getting paid for it, for my son to be less difficult, for me to be less angry.

Maybe I just watch all of this and nothing needs to be different... I know that intellectually but it just makes me sad.

Letting things be as they are makes me feel sad, like I’m not enough.

Okay..I hear you..
Peace /acceptance / surrender to what is, may come or not..
This process has only one goal:
Realizing that there is no one behind the wheel..No controller, no doer, no self of any kind.

So i strongly recommend you to stay in our posts one by one.
So it is better to drop all kind expectations of "this will happen, this may happen etc." and focus on our process :)
Letting things be as they are makes me feel sad, like I’m not enough.
It is only a thought saying "i do things, i let things happen." and there is no one to be enough..

So relax :) Nothing is under control..

Let's make you see it better

Let's start..
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

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adilerten
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Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Fri Mar 08, 2019 3:10 pm

Can you please tell me what comes when i tell you:

"THERE IS NO YOU!
In any form / shape.. There was never a you and never will be.
It is only a thought / story that someone has been born and living a life and going to die!"


Please write what comes and let's start to LOOK!
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

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BeHereNow
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Re: Help me become free

Postby BeHereNow » Fri Mar 08, 2019 8:19 pm

This thought - "There is no you!" makes me sad. There is a deep sadness that Paula as I know her does not exist, will never exist, will not make something of herself.

It makes me want to cry. I remember my mom spanking me and yelling at me when I was young, always wanting to make me better. Do more! Achieve more! Behave better! So I created a version of myself that was so accomplished, so perfect... but this version that I created only feels dissatisfied and wants more.

I see that this creation is the one that wants more, that keeps being dissatisfied and finds all kinds of tricks to make something of herself.

So now as I see these things I can feel that thinking "There is NO YOU" can be liberating! I don't have to be the Paula that I created to make my mom happy. I don't have to be anybody really because I'm not anybody.

And this thought and idea frees me of having to have a grand plan. I can just show up each day and do my best with what is presented, I don't have to go for my goals and dreams and feel disappointed each time I feel I am not measuring up.

The other thought that is coming up when I think THERE IS NO YOU! Is bullshit! I am here! How dare you! But I can almost see myself thinking this and laughing. My "self" wants so badly to be something! To be liked! To finally arrive somewhere where she can feel valued and loved.

There seems to be a solid sense of me that wants to be valued and loved. But if "there is no me" - who wants to be valued and loved? Perhaps even that can be dismantled, so there is only life in this moment?

This feels freeing, like I can finally let go of the HOLD of wanting so badly to be someone, to be some sort of coach or teacher and have everybody admire me.

Maybe my job is enough as it is, or maybe it's not even up to me to decide if I go or stay. I just do what I am called to do in each moment and life will sort it out for me...

It is scary to think "THERE IS NO YOU" because then who runs the show??? How will I ensure my life plan is met if I don't do anything????

Can I let go of the reigns and let life do it for me? Maybe life is in charge already?

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adilerten
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Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Sat Mar 09, 2019 9:19 am

This thought - "There is no you!" makes me sad. There is a deep sadness that Paula as I know her does not exist, will never exist, will not make something of herself.

It makes me want to cry. I remember my mom spanking me and yelling at me when I was young, always wanting to make me better. Do more! Achieve more! Behave better! So I created a version of myself that was so accomplished, so perfect... but this version that I created only feels dissatisfied and wants more.

I see that this creation is the one that wants more, that keeps being dissatisfied and finds all kinds of tricks to make something of herself.

So now as I see these things I can feel that thinking "There is NO YOU" can be liberating! I don't have to be the Paula that I created to make my mom happy. I don't have to be anybody really because I'm not anybody.

And this thought and idea frees me of having to have a grand plan. I can just show up each day and do my best with what is presented, I don't have to go for my goals and dreams and feel disappointed each time I feel I am not measuring up.

The other thought that is coming up when I think THERE IS NO YOU! Is bullshit! I am here! How dare you! But I can almost see myself thinking this and laughing. My "self" wants so badly to be something! To be liked! To finally arrive somewhere where she can feel valued and loved.

There seems to be a solid sense of me that wants to be valued and loved. But if "there is no me" - who wants to be valued and loved? Perhaps even that can be dismantled, so there is only life in this moment?

This feels freeing, like I can finally let go of the HOLD of wanting so badly to be someone, to be some sort of coach or teacher and have everybody admire me.

Maybe my job is enough as it is, or maybe it's not even up to me to decide if I go or stay. I just do what I am called to do in each moment and life will sort it out for me...

It is scary to think "THERE IS NO YOU" because then who runs the show??? How will I ensure my life plan is met if I don't do anything????

Can I let go of the reigns and let life do it for me? Maybe life is in charge already?
Thank you for your answer Paula,

There has never been a separate self, so show went on...always has.
It is only thought that suggests life needs to improve and that there are good and bad things in life. There is no one/no thing controlling how life unfolds as life unfolds spontaneously from moment to moment.
Realising 'no self' happens, but there will also be periods of checking, and doubting, and rechecking, and that is all normal. This exploration is just a beginning and not an ending..

Let's talk about the difference between looking and seeking

Here in liberation unleashed we will be using term "looking" and direct/actual experience often!
LOOKING is not done by thinking. It is plain looking.

The term ‘actual experience or direct experience is used to refer to experience ‘right now,’ and noticing the thought stories about them...
so ‘looking’ is just plain looking at what is here right now –
It is the raw experience of direct experiences colour, sound, smell, sensation, taste and the simple knowing of thought at face value. not the content of thought.
The key to this exploration is the careful LOOKING because it’s the act of actually LOOKING and not finding an “I” that brings about the realisation of there being no separate self.

So we will be looking a lot and you will be often hearing from me "Don't think Look!"

Let's look!
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

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adilerten
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Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Sat Mar 09, 2019 9:23 am

Can you please tell me where the finger goes/shows when you say: "me" "i" "Paula" ?
And then can you please "LOOK" what is REALLY there at the place your finger shows ?
Don't go to thought content just LOOK what is there!


Sending love
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

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BeHereNow
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Re: Help me become free

Postby BeHereNow » Sat Mar 09, 2019 1:44 pm

Hi Adil,

When I say me I Paula the finger points to my chest.

Here I look and there is a purple and pink colour (my shirt), a zipper, I look and there is a patch of hair, I look and there is some shadow and a glimpse of my fingers typing. So funny! That’s it! Nothing solid.

I love this idea of looking, not seeing, if I tried to see there would be all these concepts. If I look there is colour, slow movement, shadows, quite beautiful!!!

If I look through there is space... some solid patches but when I really look they dissolve.

My daughter just came, I am going to see if I can just look at her as well!

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adilerten
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Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Sat Mar 09, 2019 1:53 pm

Hi Adil,

When I say me I Paula the finger points to my chest.

Here I look and there is a purple and pink colour (my shirt), a zipper, I look and there is a patch of hair, I look and there is some shadow and a glimpse of my fingers typing. So funny! That’s it! Nothing solid.

I love this idea of looking, not seeing, if I tried to see there would be all these concepts. If I look there is colour, slow movement, shadows, quite beautiful!!!

If I look through there is space... some solid patches but when I really look they dissolve.

My daughter just came, I am going to see if I can just look at her as well!
Yes, very good beginning :)
Is there any self / I / me of any kind existing there where finger points ?
Or there is only color / sensations / thought labelling of what is ?
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

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BeHereNow
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Re: Help me become free

Postby BeHereNow » Sun Mar 10, 2019 1:18 am

When I look I notice something that feels it is me, a contraction of sensations and emotions like fear and sadness.

I notice if I look in order to find emptiness the form gets stronger and my attention goes there.

I notice it is fluid though, the sensations change and can’ Be fully localized.

But there is some pattern of pain and tightness around the neck and shoulders and heart in particular.

Also some fear when I realize he nothingness and the thoughts kick in trying to figure it out!

No actual “self” but just ideas of it, thoughts, emotions sensations, changing. But some sort of notion of self,idea of me Paula. Very fleeting, at short times gone but comes back.

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adilerten
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Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Sun Mar 10, 2019 12:23 pm

When I look I notice something that feels it is me, a contraction of sensations and emotions like fear and sadness.

I notice if I look in order to find emptiness the form gets stronger and my attention goes there.

I notice it is fluid though, the sensations change and can’ Be fully localized.

But there is some pattern of pain and tightness around the neck and shoulders and heart in particular.

Also some fear when I realize he nothingness and the thoughts kick in trying to figure it out!

No actual “self” but just ideas of it, thoughts, emotions sensations, changing. But some sort of notion of self,idea of me Paula. Very fleeting, at short times gone but comes back.
Thank you for your answers Paula,


So you say there is no actual self at the place that finger points.
That is true.

Can you point and locate where these thoughts appear ?
Can you control these thoughts, emotions, sensations changing ?
when you open eyes and see colours and shapes, do you need to do anything in order to see the view?
do you need to do anything to hear sounds?
how about touching things, is the sensation there by itself or you switch it on and off?
taste, smell, are you in charge of that or it's simply there?
do you move the blood and make heart beat?
do you need to manage other bodily funtions or not?

What can you control at will ?
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha


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