The Gate

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this?
There are moments of seeing there is 'no-self' and understand this mentally, but have not been able to see-through this yet. I understand when I actually look for the separate self, there isn't a tiny "controller" operating inside of my body, orchestrating every thought, movement, choice and action.

What are you looking for at LU?
To be able to finally see and let the illusion of 'my-self' go and see it for what it really is...a fairy tale, a much too important story of a make believed character of 'me'. This 'story of me' causes suffering and confusion and constant seeking for the truth.

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
To let the illusion of there being a separate self be seen through finally. To be able to let seeking go and to enjoy life as it was meant to be lived, not through a filter of "good or bad" but just as it is, what's just happening.

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?
I have been hard-core seeking for the past 5 years when I first read an Eckhart Tolle book, "The Power of Now". It hit me like a ton of bricks and seemed so familar somehow and made my insides glow with happiness. I have literally read almost every "non-dual" book out there and watched countless videos, listened to hundreds of podcasts and even had a one-on-one session with David Bingham to try to find "my true nature". Well, I'm still searching ;). I have had stretches of time when it seemed like my thoughts were barely there, or at least muted and less 'trouble' then they usually are, but then the dark clouds of 'me' come rolling back in and stir up the false sense of self again!

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self? 10

Hello 4444
:)

Thank you for your patience in waiting for a guide. I’m happy to be present in this inquiry with you if you are still ready alredy!

-Becca

Hello Becca!

I SO appreciate you reaching out...because I am definitely ready already for some inquiry!

Thanks for your presence,
:)
D

Great D,

In this dialogue you’ll be asked to LOOK carefully to what is being pointed at... setting all that has been learned about no self aside, just looking at what is effortlessly there prior to the thoughts coming. It is this simple LOOKING (not thinking) that brings a shift in perception.

Here, we are LOOKING directly into the experience of the senses, which is actually here and now, with the thinking stripped away. In this way, we are aiming to discover what is truly happening without the story we tell ourselves. For this process to work I'll ask that you answer with honesty, and not rely on philosophy, thought, imagination or memory - just reporting your direct experience.

So now an exercise:
Please read and say to yourself several times: *There is no separate self, there never was, there never will be*

After each time you read or say it, notice what happens, feelings, sensations, thoughts, movements... And write here what is noticed.

Don't try to get anything right! just share what is seen, unfiltered. Generally this process will be driven by seeing what is already happening, what is already the case. What is effortlessly seen while engaging questions and exercises is what is important. What you actually write me is secondary to that.

-Becca

There is no separate self, there never was, there never will be*

After each time you read or say it, notice what happens, feelings, sensations, thoughts, movements... And write here what is noticed.

Hi Becca,
When I said this out loud I noticed at first my body tensing up and feeling some sort of constriction based in the chest/gut region. A bittersweet feeling though, an ending to something once beloved, but maybe not believed in anymore. This statement does excite me though, brings up thoughts of being a child, watching the clouds go by...carefree curious and free. My mind though...as soon as these words stop being uttered, comes around the back door and claims the opposite, that there is indeed a separate self wrapped up in memories and valid proof of a "me" that makes up this character. I will sit with this more tonight and abide in this statement that the "separate self" is nowhere to be found when actually directly looked for.

Thank you,
D

Hi D,

So the separate self is nowhere to be found when directly looked for? Very nice. Keep checking… over and over, as if you were searching your fridge for something you had been certain was in there.

My mind though...as soon as these words stop being uttered, comes around the back door and claims the opposite, that there is indeed a separate self wrapped up in memories and valid proof of a "me" that makes up this character.

Whose thoughts are these? Is there control of them? Of any thoughts?

When the mind comes in with “there is a self,” what is it protecting? What is threatened if there isn’t one?

Hi Becca,

So the separate self is nowhere to be found when directly looked for? Very nice. Keep checking… over and over, as if you were searching your fridge for something you had been certain was in there.

Nice...I like that fridge analogy! Can I ask though, who would be choosing to do the checking over and over, this mind, using it like a tool to complete a task? This is where I can get wrapped up in an endless loop. I have searched for a separate self and at times have come to the conclusion that the self/me that I have identified with my whole life is just a consistent story that gets played on repeat. What is aware of this body/mind functioning, there is awareness here, yes, but when I hear the phrase awareness IS aware of itself, why does that phrase still feel like there are two? Most days are spent not even noticing that there is no doer, that things are happening just as they always have, almost on auto-pilot. But when engaging in a dramatic thought bubble, then everything becomes personnel again.

Whose thoughts are these? Is there control of them? Of any thoughts?

There is noticing of thoughts arising, seemingly out of thin air, nobody controlling them or creating them. If that were so, if there was a thinker, we'd never have any "bad" thoughts, right? Thoughts just happen, but why when knowing this, I can still get lost in them!

When the mind comes in with “there is a self,” what is it protecting? What is threatened if there isn’t one?

It's more of being hypnotized by the thoughts that can create suffering and fear. SO much drama swirling around in thoughts, the what-did & what-if causing regrets, fear and anxiety. Lost in thought is kinda spot on, like unable to wake from a bad dream, the thoughts being so loud and falsely personal with their constant narrating and labeling of everything that is seen and heard. How can one consistently choose to quiet down the thoughts and not be held in the temptation to get lost in them?

Best,
D

Hi D,

There’s never been a separate self to find. The search for it is like tearing the house apart looking for the burglar—only to realize you are the house. The whole premise was wrong. But the momentum of thought doesn’t care. It has to keep the illusion going.

Can I ask though, who would be choosing to do the checking over and over, this mind, using it like a tool to complete a task? This is where I can get wrapped up in an endless loop

Who indeed?

Go right to the moment before the story of a mind “doing something.”

Was there ever a separate self deciding to check anything?

Or is the entire problem just a thought trying to own what already happens?

You already noticed that thoughts arise without a controller… what is here that is not a thought?

Thoughts just happen, but why when knowing this, I can still get lost in them!

What exactly gets lost?
What changed from one moment of clarity to the next thought-dream? Track it.

being hypnotized by the thoughts that can create suffering and fear

Where is the fear? Be specific. What sensations in the body arise?

I have searched for a separate self and at times have come to the conclusion that the self/me that I have identified with my whole life is just a consistent story that gets played on repeat

Yes. It is a story. It is all a story.
What is here that is NOT a story? Right now.

Hi Becca!
Sorry it's been a few days...but lots of pondering happening over here....:)

Go right to the moment before the story of a mind “doing something.”

-Yes, in the moment before, there is a catching or recognition right before a story is created, only a few seconds of nothing.

Was there ever a separate self deciding to check anything?
Or is the entire problem just a thought trying to own what already happens?

-When the mind isn’t activated or identified with, no self is checking anything or owning anything.
This is of course much easier when spending time being quiet or reflective, then it is seen thoughts try to jump in seconds later and own what is just already happening.
When caught up in a frenzy of a moment or with a busy day, the thoughts seem like they run wild with charged energy, sometimes anxious or wanting to distract from what’s presently just happening.

You already noticed that thoughts arise without a controller… what is here that is not a thought?

Yes, I can say I do understand thoughts arise without a controller and that the story of “me” is just a series of back-logged thoughts. BUT…

“Thoughts just happen, but why when knowing this, I can still get lost in them!”
What exactly gets lost?
What changed from one moment of clarity to the next thought-dream? Track it.

-The thought machine can be enticing to get wrapped up in when not quiet or reflective. Like a dramatic bad movie you want to stop watching but can’t seem to quit. When reading or listening to non-dual teachings, everything comes to light so to speak, there is a knowing and understanding present, but still the draw to follow the manic thoughts happen between the teachings.
-The thoughts seem to create the senses that are uncomfortable or that are labeled “bad”. If not in a space of quietness and able to recognize the endless thought/senses loop, it feels like a spell gets casts with the uncontrollable pull to identify with those thoughts.

“being hypnotized by the thoughts that can create suffering and fear”
Where is the fear? Be specific. What sensations in the body arise?

The fear lands in the body, usually in the chest or the gut with the feeling of being anxious. A story gets created of an imaginary future filled with “what ifs” that are not great outcomes. This usually happens surrounding my child, like with a sickness or with second guessing parenting decisions effecting their future. I have spent some time realizing that “Mother-ing” is just happening when looking back on my parenting over the years though. But again, how to decline those invitations becomes cloudy when caught up in a frantic thought.

What is here that is NOT a story? Right now.

There is an aliveness felt by something, like something is aware of that, it feels like there is a knowing of experiences and of all the senses (including thoughts).

Some really excellent noticing here.
Let’s dig into a few areas.

Yes, in the moment before, there is a catching or recognition right before a story is created, only a few seconds of nothing.

This is gold. This gap before story… It will stretch with practice. Throughout your waking day, try to observe the gap between thoughts as often as possible. It can be done by noticing that ‘thinking’ is happening right now, then stop and just simply wait for the next thought to come.

When the mind isn’t activated or identified with, no self is checking anything or owning anything

Yes. That’s the raw truth—direct, experiential. No self was ever doing any of it. The whole show is spontaneous.


You said the fear is felt in the chest and gut—good. Stay with that.
Is that sensation actually “fear”?
Or is that a label that lands after the sensation arises?

Drop the word. Go deeper. What’s it actually like?
Is it heat? Pressure? Tightness? Something else?

“Mother-ing” is just happening

Yes. It happens NOW, not in thoughts about the future or the past.

There is an aliveness felt by something, like something is aware of that, it feels like there is a knowing of experiences and of all the senses (including thoughts).

Now look closer.
Is that “something” a thing at all?
Can it be found? Measured? Pointed to?

Or is it just the name we give to the raw fact that experience is happening?

If no “knower” can be found, yet knowing is here—what does that leave?

Not a who. Not a what. Just this.

No knower. No owner. No thinker.
Just movement. Sensation. Image. Sound. Story.
All arising… and none of it requires “you.”

So—

Right now.

Can anything in this moment be other than what it is?

Without adding a thought, what exactly needs to be changed?

Hi Becca,

“Yes, in the moment before, there is a catching or recognition right before a story is created, only a few seconds of nothing.”
This is gold. This gap before story… It will stretch with practice. Throughout your waking day, try to observe the gap between thoughts as often as possible. It can be done by noticing that ‘thinking’ is happening right now, then stop and just simply wait for the next thought to come.

I love this suggestion, it’s like when you ask yourself, “what will my next thought be?” Total silence…empty mind of nothing arising. Tried this all throughout my day yesterday and each time I waited for the next thought (between the gaps) to come, there was a sense of relaxation happening or less seriousness of the thoughts that did arise. Again only for a few moments but nice!

You said the fear is felt in the chest and gut—good. Stay with that.
Is that sensation actually “fear”?
Or is that a label that lands after the sensation arises?
Drop the word. Go deeper. What’s it actually like?
Is it heat? Pressure? Tightness? Something else?

Yes, when looked at the sensations directly, noticing of the labels slapped on as “anxious” or “fearful” but without that label, like if I suddenly couldn’t understand the language in the head, there is just some constriction/tightening in the gut and maybe some quickening heartbeat in the chest along with shallow breathing. These habitually get called “bad feelings”. Felt kinda strange to just sit with the sensations and not get pulled in by the usual backstory that calls itself “fear”.

“There is an aliveness felt by something, like something is aware of that, it feels like there is a knowing of experiences and of all the senses (including thoughts).”
Is that “something” a thing at all?
Can it be found? Measured? Pointed to?
If no “knower” can be found, yet knowing is here—what does that leave?

I’m not sure…but seems like nothing…but it doesn’t feel bleak or boring the way “nothing” can usually sound. More like expansive…space like…but that doesn’t even sound right either…just nothing that can actually be found outside of what is just here when looked at directly. The body doing what it has always done and the mind with thoughts that are actually just ebbing and flowing, they are not being taken as what's real or sticking so much.

Can anything in this moment be other than what it is?

No, there is just what is happening at the moment, it is already as it is. Seems so simple, but for the “separate self” can be impossible. Watching of the body during the days and it seems crazy to think there was ever a director taking credit for all of its complicated mechanics. Just the act of walking, breathing and digesting, these are so profound and miraculous, and yet almost every single human being does not notice that they have never been in charge of any of it!

Without adding a thought, what exactly needs to be changed?

Nothing… noticing more clearly that if something needs to be taken care of in the immediate moment…working, cooking, cleaning, etc -the things just get done. They have actually always been this way, but the narrator seemed to be directing the show before, constantly labeling and judging EVERYTHING. Life's efforts were never good enough, the life-long striving to have life be better.

Best,
D

Really really nice looking and observations D.

Next… drop all of it. :)

The summaries, the insights, the collecting of moments.

Without referencing memory, experience, or thought—is there a ‘you’ here at all?

Is there any boundary, any location, any center—any “thing” that can claim ownership of what’s arising?

Look directly.

Where is the self that is noticing the tightness in the gut, the thoughts about thoughts, the gap between them?

Can you find a center?
Or only ever the experience of searching?

If something is felt, it’s already not you.
If something is seen, heard, thought—it’s an object, not a subject.

What’s left that’s “you”?

Hi Becca,
Before a complete reply of each question, I just wanted you to clarify these statements:

If something is felt, it’s already not you.

What do you mean by the "you" here?
If there is a feeling that identifies with a thought, that is the separate self appearing and claiming it, right?

If something is seen, heard, thought—it’s an object, not a subject.

But isn't there always an awareness of sensations (seeing and hearing are just happening) being experienced? No one knows but there is a knowing? When there is identifying or sticking to the sensations, suffering seems to happens. If you could expand on this, that would be helpful.

Thank you,
D

“If something is felt, it’s already not you.”

The “you” here is the fictional center, the felt-sense of being a subject apart from what’s happening. If something is felt—whether it’s a physical sensation or an emotional wave—it’s already an object. It’s being known, noticed, experienced. Which means it can’t be you. That’s the point.

Now look. What is it that says “This is me” or “I feel this”? That’s not a neutral report—it’s identification. That’s the separate self showing up as a thought. A claiming mechanism. “This pain is mine.” But did you actually feel a “me” in the sensation? Or did the thought arise after, slapping a name tag on it?

If there is a feeling that identifies with a thought, that is the separate self appearing and claiming it, right?

The separate self isn’t “appearing”—it’s never there to begin with!! What appears is the habitual claiming mechanism: sensation, then thought, “I feel this,” “this is me.”

But isn't there always an awareness of sensations (seeing and hearing are just happening) being experienced?

Only if you’re still clinging to an invisible, imagined knower. The idea that “something must be aware” is just more story. Drop it. Go to exactly what’s happening: sound, image, sensation. Is there anyone doing that? Or just raw phenomena arising—no center, no knower, no boundary?

Hi Becca,

“If something is felt, it’s already not you.”

The “you” here is the fictional center, the felt-sense of being a subject apart from what’s happening. If something is felt—whether it’s a physical sensation or an emotional wave—it’s already an object. It’s being known, noticed, experienced. Which means it can’t be you. That’s the point.

Yes, when it is “felt” it’s already identified and the story begins…

Now look. What is it that says “This is me” or “I feel this”? That’s not a neutral report—it’s identification. That’s the separate self showing up as a thought. A claiming mechanism. “This pain is mine.” But did you actually feel a “me” in the sensation? Or did the thought arise after, slapping a name tag on it?

Yes, noticing that a lot more lately, sensations and feelings just happen, not noticed by anything or registered when the commentator is quiet, there’s nothing for them to stick to.

“If there is a feeling that identifies with a thought, that is the separate self appearing and claiming it, right?”

The separate self isn’t “appearing”—it’s never there to begin with!! What appears is the habitual claiming mechanism: sensation, then thought, “I feel this,” “this is me.”
But isn't there always an awareness of sensations (seeing and hearing are just happening) being experienced?

Yes, the separate self never there to begin with, a phantom story on repeat.

Only if you’re still clinging to an invisible, imagined knower. The idea that “something must be aware” is just more story. Drop it. Go to exactly what’s happening: sound, image, sensation. Is there anyone doing that? Or just raw phenomena arising—no center, no knower, no boundary?

There doesn’t seem to be a knower when actually looked for, no center found either, when different sounds arise can’t locate where it is exactly being heard from.

Hanging out with lots of people at a gathering yesterday, there seemed to be the absence of the usual anxious feelings beforehand and during the event. This was not noticed in “real” time but afterwards when my husband was discussing his experience, it was realized that they never materialized, was almost hard to remember the events of the day actually, but instead I think the day went on with ease and not the usual things bothering me or rather not noticing being bothered at all.

Thanks for your patience,
:)
D