threadofannihilation

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nimrod
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Re: threadofannihilation

Postby nimrod » Fri Jul 31, 2020 11:36 pm

So are thoughts done, or they happen automatically, on their own?
Automatic.
Is there any thought, any at all, that doesn’t just happen on its own, but rather it’s made to appear?
No.
Is there any control over thoughts?
No.
Are you managing what is happening (whatever is happening)?
No
What is not automatic?
Nothing.

I can't seem to directly "catch" a CLEAR thought AS it arises, but only AFTER in memory and then it is not clear. If I sit and watch, actively waiting to catch thought, none seem to arise until I forget to remember to watch and then I suddenly "awake" to the fact that I just HAD a thought instead of catching the thought arising and then like a dream it quickly dissipates. I don't know if that makes sense or is useful.
-> nimrod

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Vivien
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Re: threadofannihilation

Postby Vivien » Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:15 am

Hi nimrod,
I can't seem to directly "catch" a CLEAR thought AS it arises, but only AFTER in memory and then it is not clear.
Are you saying that you cannot notice a thought in the moment when it is present?

Let’s focus on this only, for a whole day.
You have no other task than to notice as many thoughts as possible in the moment when they are there, when they are present.

Let me know what you find.

Vivien
"In the seen, there is only the seen. In the heard, there is only the heard. In the sensed, there is only the sensed. You are located neither in this, nor in that, nor in any place between the two." - Buddha
http://fadingveiling.com/

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nimrod
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Re: threadofannihilation

Postby nimrod » Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:00 pm

Are you saying that you cannot notice a thought in the moment when it is present?

Let’s focus on this only, for a whole day.
You have no other task than to notice as many thoughts as possible in the moment when they are there, when they are present.

Let me know what you find
I am no longer so sure. Trying to stand back and watch as thoughts arise seems to keep thought from arising. Thoughts noticed after already arisen - not actively watched for - dissipate like smoke in the wind. Non verbal/auditoy thought, imagery, etc in particular are hard to see. Verbal/auditory thought engaged to a purpose like writing this are fairly clear.
-> nimrod

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Vivien
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Re: threadofannihilation

Postby Vivien » Mon Aug 03, 2020 1:58 am

Hi nimrod,
Thoughts noticed after already arisen - not actively watched for - dissipate like smoke in the wind
But I’m not asking to catch the moment when a thought arise, I’m just simply asking to notice a thought when it’s already there.

Have you noticed that sometimes there are tiny gaps between thoughts?

What is in the gap?

Is experience completely stop when there are no thoughts?
Or experience (colors, shapes, sounds, taste, smell, sensation) are still happening regardless of the presence or absence of thoughts?


Vivien
"In the seen, there is only the seen. In the heard, there is only the heard. In the sensed, there is only the sensed. You are located neither in this, nor in that, nor in any place between the two." - Buddha
http://fadingveiling.com/

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nimrod
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Re: threadofannihilation

Postby nimrod » Tue Aug 04, 2020 1:14 am

Have you noticed that sometimes there are tiny gaps between thoughts? What is in the gap?
Yes, experiencing sesnation.
Is experience completely stop when there are no thoughts?
Or experience (colors, shapes, sounds, taste, smell, sensation) are still happening regardless of the presence or absence of thoughts?
No, experience continues regardless of thoughts although often most attention is on thoughts.
-> nimrod

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Vivien
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Re: threadofannihilation

Postby Vivien » Tue Aug 04, 2020 4:00 am

Hi nimrod,

I would like to invite you just to notice whatever is present in each moment. Spend a whole day on just noticing WHAT IS, here now.

There are colors, shapes, sounds, sensations, emotions, tastes, smells… It’s all life. It’s all happening.

There are objects in the room, like chairs, table, laptop, etc. The body is also here. Movements are happening. Breathing is happening. Life is happening.

Spend as much time as possible to notice WHAT IS HERE NOW. Just notice what is. So you don’t have to search for anything. Rather just notice what is here.

Let me know what you find.

Vivien
"In the seen, there is only the seen. In the heard, there is only the heard. In the sensed, there is only the sensed. You are located neither in this, nor in that, nor in any place between the two." - Buddha
http://fadingveiling.com/

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Vivien
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Re: threadofannihilation

Postby Vivien » Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:06 am

Hi Nimrod,

I've got your email. There has been some issues with the forum, but admins are working on it. Currently it's working on and off.

so we can continue here.

Vivien
"In the seen, there is only the seen. In the heard, there is only the heard. In the sensed, there is only the sensed. You are located neither in this, nor in that, nor in any place between the two." - Buddha
http://fadingveiling.com/

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nimrod
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Re: threadofannihilation

Postby nimrod » Thu Aug 06, 2020 11:40 am

Spend as much time as possible to notice WHAT IS HERE NOW. Just notice what is. So you don’t have to search for anything. Rather just notice what is here.

Let me know what you find.
Aliveness.
-> nimrod

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Vivien
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Re: threadofannihilation

Postby Vivien » Thu Aug 06, 2020 11:59 am

Hi nimrod,

Yes, there is aliveness.

And what about experience itself?
Isn’t experience always here, in form of sounds, colors, shapes, tastes, smells, sensations, emotions, thoughts?

Is this aliveness something else or other than experience itself?


Please look at these carefully. Just notice what is here now.

Vivien
"In the seen, there is only the seen. In the heard, there is only the heard. In the sensed, there is only the sensed. You are located neither in this, nor in that, nor in any place between the two." - Buddha
http://fadingveiling.com/

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nimrod
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Re: threadofannihilation

Postby nimrod » Fri Aug 07, 2020 2:16 pm

And what about experience itself?
Isn’t experience always here, in form of sounds, colors, shapes, tastes, smells, sensations, emotions, thoughts?

Is this aliveness something else or other than experience itself?
There is always experience but behind or under sensations of thought, sound, smell, etc is a restful alertness that becomes more noticeable BETWEEN sensations.
-> nimrod

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Vivien
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Re: threadofannihilation

Postby Vivien » Sat Aug 08, 2020 12:32 am

Hi nimrod,
There is always experience but behind or under sensations of thought, sound, smell, etc is a restful alertness that becomes more noticeable BETWEEN sensations.
Sensations of thoughts? Can a thought be felt as a bodily sensation?
What do you mean by ‘between sensations’? Between what sensations?


I’m wondering if we are talking about the same thing, when we use the word ‘sensation’.
In this inquiry the word sensation refers only to felt bodily sensations / feeling, and nothing else.

Please write a bit longer description where you are at the moment. Try to be simple but precise.
I need to see where you are at the moment, so I can give you appropriate pointers.

Vivien
"In the seen, there is only the seen. In the heard, there is only the heard. In the sensed, there is only the sensed. You are located neither in this, nor in that, nor in any place between the two." - Buddha
http://fadingveiling.com/

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nimrod
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Re: threadofannihilation

Postby nimrod » Sun Aug 09, 2020 1:29 pm

I should have said arisings instead of sensations - thoughts arise, feelings arise, sensations, underneath and between arisings when they get quiet slow, there is an ever-present restful vibrating hum of aliveness, very peaceful and welcoming somehow, it feels like home.
-> nimrod

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Vivien
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Re: threadofannihilation

Postby Vivien » Mon Aug 10, 2020 1:42 am

Hi nimrod,
thoughts arise, feelings arise, sensations, underneath and between arisings when they get quiet slow, there is an ever-present restful vibrating hum of aliveness, very peaceful and welcoming somehow, it feels like home.
Yes, it feels like home :)

Now look, what is not happening automatically?

What do you do in order to be?


Vivien
"In the seen, there is only the seen. In the heard, there is only the heard. In the sensed, there is only the sensed. You are located neither in this, nor in that, nor in any place between the two." - Buddha
http://fadingveiling.com/

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nimrod
Posts: 49
Joined: Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:24 am

Re: threadofannihilation

Postby nimrod » Tue Aug 11, 2020 4:34 am

It is all happening automatically, I do nothing to be.
-> nimrod

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Vivien
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Location: Australia

Re: threadofannihilation

Postby Vivien » Tue Aug 11, 2020 4:58 am

Hi nimrod,

Now in this movement of totality, is there a separate entity, a self in charge?

Tell me about free will, how you see it?


Vivien
"In the seen, there is only the seen. In the heard, there is only the heard. In the sensed, there is only the sensed. You are located neither in this, nor in that, nor in any place between the two." - Buddha
http://fadingveiling.com/


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