English

Welcome to the main forum. When you are ready to start a conversation, register and once your application is processed a guide will come to talk to you.
This is one-on-one style forum, one thread per green member.
User avatar
LesleyBitzy
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:26 pm

Re: English

Postby LesleyBitzy » Sat Feb 08, 2020 2:07 pm

Hi Jon,
You asked me, 'Is there an experience of 'eyes seeing' or of a 'me seeing'? '.

When I read the screen I am seeing the screen.
I know, intellectually that the eyes see, but when I do the exercise and ask who or what is seeing the screen, it is I (me) that's sees the screen not the eyes.

lesley

User avatar
JonathanR
Posts: 3964
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:14 pm

Re: English

Postby JonathanR » Sat Feb 08, 2020 7:20 pm

Hi

Thank you Lesley.
. I know, intellectually that the eyes see, but when I do the exercise and ask who or what is seeing the screen, it is I (me) that's sees the screen not the eyes.
That's your actual experience?

Is that 'you' as 'awareness' that's doing the seeing? (Feel free to try the exercise again if need be, to find out).

Thanks

Jon

User avatar
LesleyBitzy
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:26 pm

Re: English

Postby LesleyBitzy » Sun Feb 09, 2020 10:42 am

Hi Jon.
As yioou suggested,
I have done this exercise a few times again now and it is my awareness that is seeing the screen.
Lesley

User avatar
JonathanR
Posts: 3964
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:14 pm

Re: English

Postby JonathanR » Sun Feb 09, 2020 11:19 pm

Hi Lesley
. I have done this exercise a few times again now and it is my awareness that is seeing the screen.
Is there an experience of a 'me' that is making awareness happen? Take a look at that.

We can talk in terms of awareness, or noticing, but what about a 'my awareness'? Check this out. Is there a direct experience of a 'my awareness',?

Here is an exercise, to try....


Find an object with an obvious, single colour. A red cup would do very well, or a, white one.

Place the object in front of you, perhaps on a table. Sit for a few moments and making no particular effort to do so simply look at it.

Now, Is the redness separate from the experience of it?

Best wishes

Jon

User avatar
JonathanR
Posts: 3964
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:14 pm

Re: English

Postby JonathanR » Thu Feb 13, 2020 6:35 pm

Hi Lesley

How are you getting on?

Jon

User avatar
LesleyBitzy
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:26 pm

Re: English

Postby LesleyBitzy » Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:28 am

Hi Jon,
I am getting on well thanks very much.
In answer to your last question,
''Is there an experience of a 'me' that is making awareness happen? Take a look at that.

We can talk in terms of awareness, or noticing, but what about a 'my awareness'? Check this out. Is there a direct experience of a 'my awareness',?

Here is an exercise, to try....


Find an object with an obvious, single colour. A red cup would do very well, or a, white one.

Place the object in front of you, perhaps on a table. Sit for a few moments and making no particular effort to do so simply look at it.

Now, Is the redness separate from the experience of it?''

The redness is not seperate from the experience of it.
It is awareness that experiences the cup.

Lesley

User avatar
JonathanR
Posts: 3964
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:14 pm

Re: English

Postby JonathanR » Fri Feb 14, 2020 12:03 pm

Hello Lesley
The redness is not seperate from the experience of it.
It is awareness that experiences the cup.
I'm currently looking at a white sheet of watercolour paper here in front of me. And 'whiteness' does definitely seem to be the experience of the white colour.

And yes, this whiteness is experienced directly. Whatever thoughts may be going on at the same time they do not seem to have anyting much at all to do with seeing.

But is awareness experiencing a sheet of paper (in your case cup)?

Noticing is happening, yes, but in this experience can I find any...thing... 'experiencing' another... thing? More to the point, in the immediate, unpremeditated experience of whiteness is there a separation into 'perceiver' and 'perceived'?

Please give this some attention. Explore it and notice what's going on.

Let me know how it goes please?

Best wishes

Jon

User avatar
LesleyBitzy
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:26 pm

Re: English

Postby LesleyBitzy » Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:03 pm

I'm currently looking at a white sheet of watercolour paper here in front of me. And 'whiteness' does definitely seem to be the experience of the white colour.

And yes, this whiteness is experienced directly. Whatever thoughts may be going on at the same time they do not seem to have anyting much at all to do with seeing.

But is awareness experiencing a sheet of paper (in your case cup)?

Noticing is happening, yes, but in this experience can I find any...thing... 'experiencing' another... thing? More to the point, in the immediate, unpremeditated experience of whiteness is there a separation into 'perceiver' and 'perceived'?

Please give this some attention. Explore it and notice what's going on.

Hi Jon,
Yes you are right.
It is noticing that is happening when I am looking at the red cup. When I am noticing the red cup or whatever I am noticing there is no separation into perciever and percieved; I am simply noticing whatever I am noticing.

Lesley

User avatar
JonathanR
Posts: 3964
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:14 pm

Re: English

Postby JonathanR » Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:40 pm

Hi Lesley,
. When I am noticing the red cup or whatever I am noticing there is no separation into perciever and percieved; I am simply noticing whatever I am noticing.
Does that seem interesting to you? Noticing that there's no separation?

How is that possible? That there's no separation, but then there seems to still be a 'me' that is imagined to be doing 'noticing'.?

Could you take a look at this sort of exercise again? This time perhaps try hearing instead? Whatever can be heard immediately, from very slight sounds (breathing for example) to louder one's such as birdsong or traffic or voices. No need to differentiate between these as they're all heard.

In the hearing Is there separation between hearing and what's heard?

All best

Jon

User avatar
LesleyBitzy
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:26 pm

Re: English

Postby LesleyBitzy » Sat Feb 15, 2020 11:13 am

Hi Jon,
The sounds all seem to be in the same space. loud or soft makes no difference.
Lesley

User avatar
JonathanR
Posts: 3964
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:14 pm

Re: English

Postby JonathanR » Sat Feb 15, 2020 8:21 pm

Hi Lesley

Thank you for doing the exercise.

Could you please respond to my questions:
. Does that seem interesting to you? Noticing that there's no separation?

How is that possible? That there's no separation, but then there seems to still be a 'me' that is imagined to be doing 'noticing'.?
Thank you.

Jon

User avatar
LesleyBitzy
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:26 pm

Re: English

Postby LesleyBitzy » Sun Feb 16, 2020 12:53 pm

Hi Jon.
In response to your question:
"Does that seem interesting to you? Noticing that there's no separation?"

Yes, that is interesting noticing that there is no separation.

"How is that possible? That there's no separation, but then there seems to still be a 'me' that is imagined to be doing 'noticing'.?"

When I notice, truly that there is ,'no separation', I am not noticing from a separate place. I am noticing only that all that is seen is the same.

Lesley

User avatar
JonathanR
Posts: 3964
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:14 pm

Re: English

Postby JonathanR » Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:17 pm

Hi Lesley
. When I notice, truly that there is ,'no separation', I am not noticing from a separate place. I am noticing only that all that is seen is the same.
That sounds great.

Is it always like this or are there times of frustration when this is not so clear?

Jon

User avatar
JonathanR
Posts: 3964
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:14 pm

Re: English

Postby JonathanR » Sat Feb 22, 2020 9:28 am

Hello Lesley

Are you keen to continue your inquiry? Please let me know?

Thanks

Jon

User avatar
LesleyBitzy
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:26 pm

Re: English

Postby LesleyBitzy » Sat Feb 22, 2020 10:53 am

Hi Jon,
I have decided that I do not want to continue the inquiry. Thanks very much for your responses.

Kind regards

lesley


Return to “THE GATE”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest