Looking for a Guide

[DebbieGinnie]

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this?
I understand this to mean that everything is one. I intellectually understand that we are all connected, that everything is connected. Experientially, however, I have not seen through the separate self.

What are you looking for at LU?
I hope to have a first awakening, to see beyond the fiction of the separate self. I have been watching a lot of Pernille Damore's groups, videos, and inquiries about the fetters. She strongly recommends getting a guide through LU.

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
I hope to be prompted and supported to look at my sensations and experiences in new ways. It seems unlikely that I will be able to dissolve the sense of the separate self without an outsider observing my blind spots and defenses.

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?
Honestly, I struggle to meditate. It's frustrating and painful for me. I struggle to make myself read books about waking up. Reading seems effortful. I am older (age 60) and pretty exhausted at this point. I do watch a lot of nonduality videos on YouTube.

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self?
10

[Elad]

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this?
I understand this to mean that everything is one. I intellectually understand that we are all connected, that everything is connected. Experientially, however, I have not seen through the separate self.

What are you looking for at LU?
I hope to have a first awakening, to see beyond the fiction of the separate self. I have been watching a lot of Pernille Damore's groups, videos, and inquiries about the fetters. She strongly recommends getting a guide through LU.

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
I hope to be prompted and supported to look at my sensations and experiences in new ways. It seems unlikely that I will be able to dissolve the sense of the separate self without an outsider observing my blind spots and defenses.

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?
Honestly, I struggle to meditate. It's frustrating and painful for me. I struggle to make myself read books about waking up. Reading seems effortful. I am older (age 60) and pretty exhausted at this point. I do watch a lot of nonduality videos on YouTube.

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self?
10

Hello, my name is Elad and I would be happy to do this exploration with you, if we see that it makes sense. Please read and respond to the following points.

1. During this process we will attend only to your own direct experience. We will not be discussing theories or beliefs or other methods, including from non-duality and etc. I will ask you questions and give exercises and you will look and answer me from your direct experience. You don't need to be a meditator or a big reader, but it is important you feel very motivated and commited to do exercises and look at questions from the guide, and write your most clear and true answers.

2. The two most important ingredients in this process are your wish to see what is true and your willingness to look deeply at questions, give wholehearted engagement to experiments/exercises presented to you, and report your experience here with 100% honesty. You don't need to be a meditator or a big reader, but it is important you feel very motivated and commited to do exercises and look at questions from the guide, and write your most clear and true answers.

3. Please read the following documents from LU *carefully* and let me know if you have any reservations or doubts regarding them:


http://liberationunleashed.com/disclaimer-2

And:

http://liberationunleashed.com/about/faq/#faq-1041


4. For the process to be focused and fruitful, I like to make an agreement that both guide and client (i.e you and me if we do this together) respond on this thread every day, and in the case of special circumstances where we cannot, still touch space here on the thread to say so, the day before or on the day. In the same spirit, I work with people who have the motivation and availability to make this process a primary priority in their life for the duration of the cooperation. If any of this does not fit your life rhythm, style or preferences, please let me know and another guide will work with you.

What may I call you?

Warmly,
Elad

[DebbieGinnie]

Hello, my name is Elad and I would be happy to do this exploration with you, if we see that it makes sense.

Thank you!

Please read and respond to the following points.

1. During this process we will attend only to your own direct experience. it is important you feel very motivated and commited to do exercises and look at questions from the guide, and write your most clear and true answers.

I feel ready to commit to all of this.

2. The two most important ingredients in this process are your wish to see what is true and your willingness to look deeply at questions, give wholehearted engagement to experiments/exercises presented to you, and report your experience here with 100% honesty. You don't need to be a meditator or a big reader, but it is important you feel very motivated and commited to do exercises and look at questions from the guide, and write your most clear and true answers.
I feel ready to do this.

3. Please read the following documents from LU *carefully* and let me know if you have any reservations or doubts regarding them:

No reservations or doubts here
http://liberationunleashed.com/disclaimer-2
http://liberationunleashed.com/about/faq/#faq-1041

4. For the process to be focused and fruitful, I like to make an agreement that both guide and client (i.e you and me if we do this together) respond on this thread every day, and in the case of special circumstances where we cannot, still touch space here on the thread to say so, the day before or on the day. In the same spirit,

I work with people who have the motivation and availability to make this process a primary priority in their life for the duration of the cooperation.

If any of this does not fit your life rhythm, style or preferences, please let me know and another guide will work with you.
Your preference makes sense to me. You want your clients to be wholehearted. I will try my best.

What may I call you?

Deb or Debbie
Looking forward to working with you!

Warmly,
Elad

[Elad]

Hi Deb, great, let's start!

1) "there is no separate self in any shape or form and there never was" - what reactions come up as you read that sentence?

Just rant about it without censoring. Give particular attention to thoughts coming up that are emotionally charged, even if you think they might be irrational. Also don't miss writing any strong beliefs about this that come up. Just write without censoring or limiting.

2) What are your expectations for what will be different in life after first awakening, after seeing through the separate self? Describe all of them as thoroughly as possible.

[DebbieGinnie]

“there is no separate self in any shape or form and there never was" - what reactions come up as you read that sentence?

I feel frustrated: While I don't have trouble with the idea a unified field beneath all the apparent separation, I just don't get how we can say there is no separate self.

I am a lifelong nail-biter. When I chew my nails too low, I feel pain. You don't feel the pain because I didn't bite your nails. Isn't that evidence of separation?

I will be taking my dog out soon. She runs very fast. As a separate being, there is no way I can keep up with her, as much as I would like to. Neither of us can fly with the hawk we saw yesterday.

What are your expectations for what will be different in life after first awakening, after seeing through the separate self? Describe all of them as thoroughly as possible.

I have heard that it is not good to have expectations. I have heard it is actually very ordinary, just overlooked. I admit that I do have hopes for increased peace, decreased reactivity, greater clarity, and being more present and accepting of others.

[Elad]

Hi Deb

"I feel frustrated: While I don't have trouble with the idea a unified field beneath all the apparent separation, I just don't get how we can say there is no separate self.

I am a lifelong nail-biter. When I chew my nails too low, I feel pain. You don't feel the pain because I didn't bite your nails. Isn't that evidence of separation?

I will be taking my dog out soon. She runs very fast. As a separate being, there is no way I can keep up with her, as much as I would like to. Neither of us can fly with the hawk we saw yesterday."


Good you share those thoughts. A few things to clarify. On a relative level, obviously separation exists, as you point out with clarity. The non-separation we will help you realize here is on an ultimate level. Metaphorically I can point to it like this: Right hand and left hand are separated. If I bite the nail of the right hand, the nails in the left handed are not being bitten. And yet, both hands are part of the same body and not separate in an ultimate sense. Now, this metaphor might clarify something for you or not. It's nice if it does, but ultimately what will matter here, is not what we can argue about with thoughts and descriptions like the ones you gave, or the one I give here. It's good you shared this - that's exactly what I asked you to do, and it's good get these thoughts out in the open. And - its important from here to understand, that analysis such as yours and mine here do not lead to awakening. Awakening is not in thoughts, only in direct seeing, which is what we will turn to in the next posts, but first to your other response:


"I have heard that it is not good to have expectations. I have heard it is actually very ordinary, just overlooked. I admit that I do have hopes for increased peace, decreased reactivity, greater clarity, and being more present and accepting of others."

Good, the honesty is good, and those are reasonable long term wishes for awakening. That being said, for some people the first main experience in seeing is profound dissapointment and painful/aversive feelings, as dreams are seen to not be true, and are let go. If then the reality and the feelings are accepted and embraced with love, the qualities you described ensue.

1) Are you willing to proceed knowing it might be like that for you, and to let go of any expectations to experience relief and enjoyment from this in the near future? (you might well do, but you also might not). Are you willing to staying lovingly focused on what is true and real, no matter how it feels?

Please now do the following two exercises (next messages):

[Elad]

2) Coloured Socks


There is a big difference between knowing that there is nothing to give up and seeing that there is nothing to give up.
Here is an example to illustrate the difference:

If I ask you what colour socks you are wearing right now you have two ways to come up with an answer:

• You can have a think about it, you can think back to this morning and try to remember putting your socks on, and you can probably tell me what colour you think they are.

• Alternatively, you can take a quick look at your socks and tell me what colour they actually are!
Hopefully you would agree that you can only be 100% certain by looking.

For the purpose of our dialogue together, it is going to be very important that you are clear about this difference. Knowing is about knowledge which is all in the mind and we are not interested in that. We are only interested in looking at and seeing what is actually going on in your present moment to moment experience. We are only interested in your direct experience in the moment.

*Please let me know if you are clear about this or if you would like any further clarification*.

3) Direct Experience - Labelling Daily Activities

Here's an exercise that I would like you to try as many times throughout the day as you can. Label daily activities simply colour/image, sound, smell, taste, sensation, thought. So for example, when having breakfast, become aware of:

Seeing a cup, simply= image/color
Smelling coffee, simply = smell
Feeling the warmth of the coffee cup, simply = sensation
Tasting the coffee, simply = taste
Hearing the spoon stirring the coffee, simply = sound
Thought about drinking the coffee, simply = thought

Just break down daily activities into these categories (which are all actual/direct experience) and report back how you go. Please do it in two ways: (1) during normal activity when possible just label moments of experience internally this way (like if I do it now: sight, sound, sight, feeling, thought, sound, etc.). And one time during the day write me 5 minutes where you practice and write at the same time and use the format above. Here is an example of me doing that:

seeing screen, simply= sight
hearing woman talk on the street, simply= sound
hearing bird chirp, simply= sounds
seiing fingers moving, simply= sight
feeling itch on the scalp of the head, simply= sensation

Let me know what you notice from doing this exercise.

[DebbieGinnie]

for some people the first main experience in seeing is profound dissapointment and painful/aversive feelings, as dreams are seen to not be true, and are let go. If then the reality and the feelings are accepted and embraced with love, the qualities you described ensue.

Are you willing to proceed knowing it might be like that for you, and to let go of any expectations to experience relief and enjoyment from this in the near future? (you might well do, but you also might not). Are you willing to staying lovingly focused on what is true and real, no matter how it feels?

I am willing to focus on what is true no matter how it feels.

[DebbieGinnie]

Knowing is about knowledge which is all in the mind and we are not interested in that. We are only interested in looking at and seeing what is actually going on in your present moment to moment experience. We are only interested in your direct experience in the moment.

The socks example makes it very clear.

[DebbieGinnie]

And one time during the day write me 5 minutes where you practice and write at the same time and use the format above. Here is an example of me doing that:

seeing screen, simply= sight
hearing woman talk on the street, simply= sound
hearing bird chirp, simply= sounds
seiing fingers moving, simply= sight
feeling itch on the scalp of the head, simply= sensation

Let me know what you notice from doing this exercise.

All experience is a sight, sound, sensation, smell, taste,or thought.

Seeing the picture, simply = sight
Hearing the fan, simply = sound
Feeling the material against my thigh, simply = sensation
Hoping that I will see through separation, simply = thought
Hearing my spouse clear his throat, simply = sound
Seeing the patterns on the wallpaper, simply = sight
Trying to land on some new object for this exercise, simply = thought
Feeling the pressure in my upper back, simply = sensation
Feeling the cool air in my nostrils when I inhale, simply = sensation
Wondering if I have accomplished enough in the 5 minutes, simply = thought

[Elad]

Great, all of this. I will send another time limited exercise for today soon, but also keep practicing with this labeling of experience during normal activity for one whole day and report about it at the end.

[Elad]

“I” labelling

Get a sheet of paper and draw a line that divides that sheet in half. Label one half 'self' and the other side 'other'. Sit down and start a timer for 5 minutes. Every time you have a thought make a mark on the sheet. If that thought is about the self put a mark on the self side, if it’s about something else, mark the other side. If a thought about food occurs due to feeling hungry, mark that on the self side. Any thought that refers back to a self should go on the self side. (I'm bored, I'm tired, is the door locked (my safety) that video was funny (I was amused), my back hurts, I am frightened) get it?

Let me know how you go and what you notice.

[DebbieGinnie]

Great, all of this. I will send another time limited exercise for today soon, but also keep practicing with this labeling of experience during normal activity for one whole day and report about it at the end.

Will do! Thanks for sharing your time Elad!

[Elad]

Great, all of this. I will send another time limited exercise for today soon, but also keep practicing with this labeling of experience during normal activity for one whole day and report about it at the end.

Will do! Thanks for sharing your time Elad!

With pleasure and joy :)

[DebbieGinnie]

I confess to having some “worrying about displeasing the teacher” kind of thoughts with this report back to you. Anyway, here goes: When I remembered to do it, noticing seeing was the most common sense field that came up. When I was outside simply seeing, there was some sense of quiet/calm/brightness.

Of all the sense fields though, it is clear I spent so much more of my time lost in the thought world and retreated to my typical downtime habit of listening to YouTube videos as one of my ways to soothe my uneasiness in silence. Today, I tried not to start another video when one ended. I noticed hearing the wind rattle the dead oak leaves. I labeled the sensing of my hand on the pruner then labeled the thought “this is boring” before escaping back into YouTube podcast world.