Relationships

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Kaliva
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Re: Relationships

Postby Kaliva » Tue Aug 04, 2020 4:52 pm

Hallo, Jadzia. I delayed the answer because it was difficult for me to find these recurring thoughts that made me anxious. Maybe they sound like, "I'm alone ... I'm missing something ... I'm missing someone" .... and I start thinking about "someone". Usually for a man. If I'm in a relationship, I'm calmer. But if I feel any signal that the relationship is insecure, I become anxious and obsess over saving it at all costs. If I'm not in a relationship (and this rarely happens) I become anxious because I'm alone. Then I connect with someone and everything repeats itself ... I'm tired ... I don't like it ... I already understand that what is missing is me. I want to learn to feel good and at ease with myself, whether I'm in a relationship or not ...

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Jadzia
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Re: Relationships

Postby Jadzia » Tue Aug 04, 2020 5:47 pm

Does one choose thoughts? Can you pick what to think?
Now you've been so hunting recurring thoughts that you missed two questions. ;-)

Recurring thoughts can circle around everything, like:" I don't like myself if I do this and that", or "This person is so ....." or whatever. Every topic, and they sure can create suffering. Conflicts usually bring up a lot of circling thoughts.
We all know something like that in this or that way.
What we all share, too, is the belief that these thoughts are true. We think (thoughts, right?) that they show what really is, we buy the story. Some think they aren't loved and there is a whole story, many chapters, about why this is so, how this happens, why one isn't worth much and so on. Others like you have a whole story running that they can't be alone, that they aren't complete without partner, a story you aren't alone with. And everything is accompanied by different feelings and sensations.
We are able to take these stories so personal which really gives them a lot of importance and weight.

Here is the big question:
A story must happen to someone. But is there really a separate entity called self, myself, to whom this happens?
If you would read a story about a woman describing your story would it be the same?

In your intro you wrote
The way I understand it is that the idea of ​​a separate self was born and exists because of my parents. They called me their child, they gave me a name, they told me "you're a girl", "you are", and after a while I thought "I am", "I'm something different from the others". And I began to believe that..
Imagine dropping the belief, how would you feel about the story`?

Love,
Jadzia

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Kaliva
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Re: Relationships

Postby Kaliva » Tue Aug 04, 2020 9:09 pm

I understand all this, but isn't this my story? :) if I read the story about a woman with my story I would probably identify with her .... but! ... it won't be my story though ... but it will be the same ... um ...
Regarding "Does one choose thouhts? Can you pick what to think?", I don't think we can choose our thoughts, but we can choose which thoughts to pay attention to, which to believe in, and I guess it's the same with stories. I believed in my story and decided it was real. But which is true? That I just AM? Because I exist like everyone else? And everyone has believed in their story? Oh! It started to get interesting ... If I stop believing in my story then I will be able to ... something like ... be born again! Then I will be able to write a new story as I like! WOW !!! But won't this new story be MINE again? Or is there no need for a story? Maybe I should BE, just BE? Just to be alive and follow life without prejudices and evaluations? Is it possible? I want to share with you that I am very excited now, so many new questions and opportunities! I felt free and I hope to keep that feeling ...

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Jadzia
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Re: Relationships

Postby Jadzia » Wed Aug 05, 2020 8:39 am

It is a good scent to follow, yes. :-)
Regarding "Does one choose thouhts? Can you pick what to think?", I don't think we can choose our thoughts, but we can choose which thoughts to pay attention to, which to believe in, and I guess it's the same with stories.
Thoughts come and go and there is no choosing which one comes, yes, but make sure of it. Choose a thought and only try to think this one thought. Is it possible?
Can you decide not to think something?
Observe and see what is. "I think we can...." isn't strong enough.
If I stop believing in my story then I will be able to ... something like ... be born again! Then I will be able to write a new story as I like! WOW !!!
Oh, we so would like that, wouldn't we? Just have that in life what we like and that which we don't like won't be in the story, nada, nope, not at all.
But isn't it like trying to live another life than the one already there? Isn't it like saying life got it all wrong?
What if it is alright?
And alas, who is there to write the story, a new one? Kaliva?
Or is there no need for a story? Maybe I should BE, just BE? Just to be alive and follow life without prejudices and evaluations? Is it possible? I want to share with you that I am very excited now, so many new questions and opportunities! I felt free and I hope to keep that feeling ...
Would it be possible for story just to be around, I mean, hey, it can be real fun. Who doesn't like a story? We love books, films, series, listening to stories of other people. What about it simply being a point of view?

Being sound interesting, doesn't it?
Is it the I am or just am? Simply being?

Go follow these thoughts and share what you find. Be excited - it is sooooo exciting.
erm.... this is why we guide, it is so enjoyable watching the sky become clearer.

Love,
Jadzia

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Jadzia
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Re: Relationships

Postby Jadzia » Mon Aug 10, 2020 5:34 pm

How are you? Everything ok?

Love,
Jadzia

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Kaliva
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Re: Relationships

Postby Kaliva » Mon Aug 10, 2020 6:46 pm

Half an hour ago I sent an answer but I don't see it on the wall. Please write if you see it somewhere. Should I send it again?

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Jadzia
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Re: Relationships

Postby Jadzia » Mon Aug 10, 2020 7:15 pm

Sometimes answers get lost. Please post it again. Thanks.

Love,
Jadzia

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Kaliva
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Re: Relationships

Postby Kaliva » Mon Aug 10, 2020 7:26 pm

Hello, here I am again .... Everything is fine, I was very busy these days and it takes me more time to make sense of what you wrote and answer, because my English is not very good. And not just because of the language, I need to focus and consider the answer. I'm here .... I'm ... hahaha .... How much "I" ... Okay, so ...
[Choose a thought and only try to think this one thought. Is it possible?
Can you decide not to think something?]
I tried and made sure we couldn't choose our thoughts. We can think purposefully, we can direct our thoughts to solve problems, we can focus on certain aspects of our being, but we cannot choose what thoughts go through our mind.
[But isn't it like trying to live another life than the one already there? Isn't it like saying life got it all wrong?
What if it is alright?
And alas, who is there to write the story, a new one? Kaliva?]
It would be really weird to write a new story. It sounds like someone is erasing your memory, I don't think it's possible and I don't need it. And was everything wrong or good? Who knows? I'm starting to think that it's really all a matter of perspective ... I put myself in my mother's shoes - she has her story for me, my grandmother too, my father, my sister and so on .... Did they do badly? Surely ... Did they do well? Certainly ... The same goes for me - sometimes I do well, sometimes not so much ... Wow! My thoughts went back and I felt warmth and love. We all revolve in a circle of relationships and love ... each in his own way ... and so until the end of the world :)))
[Being sound interesting, doesn't it?
Is it the I am or just am? Simply being?]
I can not fully comprehend the idea of JUST BEING or I AM ... I I am everywhere, constantly: "I drink beer", "I go to work", "I was sent a letter", "I have an appointment, I love watermelon ...", etc. How can you just be? Without any idea who you are? No memories, no favorite things? Like an organism that doesn't know what it exists for, doesn't know about itself ... I don't know ... it doesn't sound nice to me :))) I was thinking these days ... is it possible for all of us to have some basic mind? And on its basis to each build their own story?
Thank you so much for caring if I'm okay! I want you to know that our story will happen slowly but with all my heart.
With love, Kaliva

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Jadzia
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Re: Relationships

Postby Jadzia » Mon Aug 10, 2020 8:39 pm

English isn't my first language either, so whenever something is not clear it doesn't necessarily have to be your understanding. OK? ;-)
And time doesn't matter.
I tried and made sure we couldn't choose our thoughts. We can think purposefully, we can direct our thoughts to solve problems, we can focus on certain aspects of our being, but we cannot choose what thoughts go through our mind.
Hm, hm hm....ok, you cannot chose what thoughts go through your mind... how can you think purposefully, how can you direct thoughts and so on if you can't?
Look closely, there are always thoughts telling so, I am doing this or that, but is it what is really happening?
I'm starting to think that it's really all a matter of perspective ... I put myself in my mother's shoes - she has her story for me, my grandmother too, my father, my sister and so on
Interesting, isn't it? All stories are from a special point of view, sometimes they match, sometimes they don't match with the story someone else tells.
How can you just be? Without any idea who you are? No memories, no favorite things? Like an organism that doesn't know what it exists for, doesn't know about itself ... I don't know ... it doesn't sound nice to me :))) I was thinking these days ... is it possible for all of us to have some basic mind? And on its basis to each build their own story?
Would it be like this?
The separate self which is the conductor of life events, the decider, thinker, doer and the one who is in is a myth, always been. Never been different. A belief shared by a lot of people doesn't make reality. Still life is at it is, memory and all.

It is very important to differentiate between thought from that what can be experienced directly.
Check a thought and see what it is about. Is it about something that can be experienced right now or not? What can be really known?
A mind? Can one directly experience mind? Try, can you?
Take for example an apple, grab it, sniff at it, bite into it (all food is ok).
What is the difference?

Love,
Jadzia

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Kaliva
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Re: Relationships

Postby Kaliva » Wed Aug 12, 2020 8:27 am

"Hm, hm hm .... ok, you can't choose what thoughts go through your mind ... how can you think purposefully, how can you direct thoughts and so on if you can't?
Look closely, there are always thoughts telling so, I am doing this or that, but is it what is really happening? "
Okay, yes ... I meant we can't choose which thought comes to mind but we can decide what to do with it, how important it is to us, whether we should pay attention or throw it in the trash ... .which actually means that we can choose what to think about, we can consciously direct our attention or divert it ... and yes, for example, the thought "I'm alone", how true is it actually? I'm not alone in the world, I'm alone right now, but what she tells me is "you're alone, it's awful and scary, nobody loves you, you're like a monster underground"! Is this true? Absolutely not! Can I stop thinking that way? Absolutely YES! So I can choose thoughts like from a menu ?! Hahahaha, great!
"The separate self which is the conductor of life events, the decider, thinker, doer and the one who is in is a myth, has always been. Never been different. A belief shared by a lot of people doesn't make reality. Still life is at it is, memory and all. "
Oh! It's hard for me to understand ... I mean, I understand it but my mind seems to resist accepting it ... this machine has a hard time calculating it ... it struggles with the idea, it says "But how? Your" I " is all you have! How come it doesn't exist? " ... and my mind gets distracted, it starts thinking about simple things like "what are we going to eat now, smoke a cigarette ..." Hahahaha !!! :))) Sly!
"It is very important to differentiate between thought from what can be experienced directly.
Check a thought and see what it is about. Is it about something that can be experienced right now or not? What can be really known?
A mind? Can one directly experience mind? Try, can you?
Take for example an apple, grab it, sniff at it, bite into it (all food is ok).
What is the difference? "
The difference is that the mind is constantly moving back and forth, either in the future or in the past, in before and after ... and direct experience is here and now. And no, I can't directly experience the mind unlike the apple I ate ... wow, I got a headache :))) What can be really known?
love, Kaliva

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Jadzia
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Re: Relationships

Postby Jadzia » Wed Aug 12, 2020 11:07 am

Kaliva, could you please use the Quote function? It makes reading answers so much easier. You can click Quote and then copy my text into it.

Where do you find the I that chooses to direct or divert attention to a thought?
Remember, there is something which can be experienced directly and something which only happens in thought, in the story we believe and we 'think' we are.

Have you ever had a thought you don't want to pay attention to and still it repeated itself over and over again?
Have you ever thought something and wanted to keep it because it was such a good/important thought and it disappeared?
Did any thought you never wanted to think come back again?
If you answer with yes, then your theories don't hold.
The difference is that the mind is constantly moving back and forth, either in the future or in the past, in before and after ... and direct experience is here and now. And no, I can't directly experience the mind unlike the apple I ate ... wow, I got a headache :))) What can be really known?
What can be really known? This is biggest question here.

Lets see:
....mind is constantly moving back and forth,....
Can this be known? You stated that mind cannot be experienced directly, so what is this statement of what mind does, or should I say supposedly does? A fact, a belief, an assumption?

We can say that there are thoughts which we could label:
thoughts about the past/memory
thoughts about the future/daydreaming
thoughts about judgement, beliefs, ideas, pictures and so on. Nice.
But for what we do here we need to discern if a thought points to another thought, like a memory, or if it points to something which can be directly experienced right now.
Take a piece of paper and listen to thoughts, mark thoughts which point to other thoughts on one side of the paper and thoughts w´hich point to something which can be experienced to the other side.
Do this for five minutes. Share what you find.

Love
Jadzia

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Kaliva
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Re: Relationships

Postby Kaliva » Thu Aug 13, 2020 7:43 pm

Take a piece of paper and listen to thoughts, mark thoughts which point to other thoughts on one side of the paper and thoughts w´hich point to something which can be experienced to the other side.
Do this for five minutes. Share what you find.
I'm really amazed by this experiment! it turned out that I filled the whole sheet with what I am experiencing directly, and I wrote only two thoughts related to my plans for tomorrow. There were certain moments when I had the feeling that I wasn't thinking about anything, but I was actually thinking about whether I was thinking about something.
You stated that mind cannot be experienced directly, so what is this statement of what mind does, or should I say supposedly does? A fact, a belief, an assumption?
Apparently it's about admission ... very strange, it seems that our mind are full of assumptions even about himself ...What can be really known? Сan we know our mind? Is he ours at all?
Remember, there is something which can be experienced directly and something which only happens in thought, in the story we believe and we 'think' we are.
Okay, I'm starting to understand ... To distinguish what is from what I think is ... To distinguish facts and direct experience from thoughts that believe, admit and tell stories. Do I understand correctly?
Love, Kaliva

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Jadzia
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Re: Relationships

Postby Jadzia » Thu Aug 13, 2020 7:54 pm

it turned out that I filled the whole sheet with what I am experiencing directly, and I wrote only two thoughts related to my plans for tomorrow. There were certain moments when I had the feeling that I wasn't thinking about anything, but I was actually thinking about whether I was thinking about something.
Can you give me some examples?
Apparently it's about admission ... very strange, it seems that our mind are full of assumptions even about himself ...What can be really known? Сan we know our mind? Is he ours at all?
Good questions?
Find out what really can be known and what not - have a look.
Can you know mind or can you only imagine one?
Is mind yours, is story personal?
To distinguish facts and direct experience from thoughts that believe, admit and tell stories. Do I understand correctly?
Yesssssss! :-)

Love,
Jadzia

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Kaliva
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Re: Relationships

Postby Kaliva » Thu Aug 13, 2020 8:16 pm

Can you give me some examples?
I have to get a notebook
I think about my thoughts
I watch what time it is
I'm tired, I'm sleepy
Should I wash the dishes now or tomorrow?
I'm lazy
I think about writing
I watch my hand
There is hair on the sheet
I read what I wrote, etc.
Find out what really can be known and what not - have a look.
I will :)

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Jadzia
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Re: Relationships

Postby Jadzia » Thu Aug 13, 2020 8:35 pm

Thanks.
Could you mark what is direct experience and what just happens in thoughts?

Love,
Jadzia


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