A jump to truth.

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s-p-a-c-e
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Re: A jump to truth.

Postby s-p-a-c-e » Tue Jun 23, 2020 4:53 pm

More a voice in the head.

Again no answer to the questions.
Ok, nice.

So the voice in the head is what?
"The more he looked inside, the more Piglet wasn't there." - A.A.Milne

Author, The Faun's Apprentice - see on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fauns-Apprenti ... B01AR2B63U

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Nigeluzito
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Re: A jump to truth.

Postby Nigeluzito » Thu Jun 25, 2020 9:15 am

The voice in the head as far as I can tell is a mixture of ideas,emotions, conditioning, memories creating a filter preventing the direct experience of life here.

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Re: A jump to truth.

Postby s-p-a-c-e » Thu Jun 25, 2020 9:46 am

The voice in the head as far as I can tell is a mixture of ideas,emotions, conditioning, memories creating a filter preventing the direct experience of life here.

Ok, so we have a sensation behind the eyes with zero autonomy.
We have a voice in the head with zero autonomy.

Anywhere else where autonomy might be?

Best wishes,
John
"The more he looked inside, the more Piglet wasn't there." - A.A.Milne

Author, The Faun's Apprentice - see on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fauns-Apprenti ... B01AR2B63U

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s-p-a-c-e
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Re: A jump to truth.

Postby s-p-a-c-e » Thu Jun 25, 2020 9:48 am

...because in the story of "Nigel" there is autonomy, for sure, no?

So we check, is this autonomy, or the story of autonomy?
"The more he looked inside, the more Piglet wasn't there." - A.A.Milne

Author, The Faun's Apprentice - see on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fauns-Apprenti ... B01AR2B63U

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Nigeluzito
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Re: A jump to truth.

Postby Nigeluzito » Thu Jun 25, 2020 10:56 am

Yes there is the sense of autonomy.

I don´t know if there is true autonomy outside the conditioned processing that seems to happen.

The story that has been built up and seems to govern, seems to decide and accept the consequences.

If the autonomy is story , there is the possibility of being trapped / indentified with the story and not being able to view with clarity .....

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Re: A jump to truth.

Postby s-p-a-c-e » Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:10 am

Yes there is the sense of autonomy.

I don´t know if there is true autonomy outside the conditioned processing that seems to happen.

The story that has been built up and seems to govern, seems to decide and accept the consequences.

If the autonomy is story , there is the possibility of being trapped / indentified with the story and not being able to view with clarity .....

Speak directly to this sense of autonomy and ask it to lift your left hand.

What happens?
"The more he looked inside, the more Piglet wasn't there." - A.A.Milne

Author, The Faun's Apprentice - see on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fauns-Apprenti ... B01AR2B63U

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Nigeluzito
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Re: A jump to truth.

Postby Nigeluzito » Fri Jun 26, 2020 8:35 am

When I followed your instructions the hand didn´t move.

Your instructions imply two parts that which speaks and the sense of autonomy. The mind wants to analyse this but I prefer not to go there.

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s-p-a-c-e
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Re: A jump to truth.

Postby s-p-a-c-e » Fri Jun 26, 2020 10:54 am

When I followed your instructions the hand didn't move.

Yep!

So, the story of autonomy we've been living with for all these years, what do we do?

Carry on regardless, pretending it's true?
"The more he looked inside, the more Piglet wasn't there." - A.A.Milne

Author, The Faun's Apprentice - see on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fauns-Apprenti ... B01AR2B63U

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Nigeluzito
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Re: A jump to truth.

Postby Nigeluzito » Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:22 pm

There is a story which owns/claims everything to maintain it´s seeming reality.

The investigation is knocking bricks out of the story although the false wall still stands. The habit maintains itself ignoring /forgetting inconvienent information.

That which filters all events for it´s own view, will not cooperate in undoing itself presumably.

A more fundamental level would seem to have to withdraw support.....

"I" can only look as honestly as I am capable and let the bricks fall.

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Re: A jump to truth.

Postby s-p-a-c-e » Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:26 pm

There is a story which owns/claims everything to maintain it´s seeming reality.

The investigation is knocking bricks out of the story although the false wall still stands. The habit maintains itself ignoring /forgetting inconvienent information.

That which filters all events for it´s own view, will not cooperate in undoing itself presumably.

A more fundamental level would seem to have to withdraw support.....

"I" can only look as honestly as I am capable and let the bricks fall.

For that which filters all events to not cooperate, it would need to exist, wouldn't it?
"The more he looked inside, the more Piglet wasn't there." - A.A.Milne

Author, The Faun's Apprentice - see on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fauns-Apprenti ... B01AR2B63U

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Nigeluzito
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Re: A jump to truth.

Postby Nigeluzito » Sat Jun 27, 2020 1:11 pm

A good point.

Something ( or not thing!) we could call it reality, for example, is recieving perceptions thoughts sensations. I heard a new word yesterday which I liked.."bodyworld" which suggests how the body makes possible the world which it is itself a part of; a sort of self sustaining loop. But only the mysterious reality allows there to be the world, usually experienced as around a body.There is the possibility of "seeing" more directly the bodyworld without the conditioning filter, which is a creation in a subtler form ideas and emotions, a definite improvement but still limiting reality.

We can admit more complication with the body having different bodies with more subtle material and perceptions and more subtle bodyworlds. Again all being sustained by reality and reality being limited by the body / bodyworld experience. As reality is creating / allowing all these levels of experience, without i,t everthing would disappear. So reality would seem to have the ability to withdraw to the point of creation in some form or to non creation where the formless cannot experience.

It would seem that what I am truely is not a story, nor a mental emotional filter, not a body nor the bodyworld which is experienced.I am that reality which can experience through its creation. I could speculate about forgetting this, or becoming indentified with the body / mind and the resulting bodyworld, but this is far beyond the minds possibilties.

So I am left with that I as reality I have accepted all the limitations to experience this bodyworld. I have also as reality in some way opened the possibility of reality recognising itself. This has created a situation of change, the body / mind attempting to remove obstacles, understand, move in a certain direction. In conclusion some type of jump of reality within it´s own creation to a point of it´s own choosing.

A slight investigation of the existence of the mind filter leads to a SURRENDER to reality as my fundamental nature.

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s-p-a-c-e
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Re: A jump to truth.

Postby s-p-a-c-e » Sat Jun 27, 2020 3:16 pm

A good point.

Something ( or not thing!) we could call it reality, for example, is recieving perceptions thoughts sensations. I heard a new word yesterday which I liked.."bodyworld" which suggests how the body makes possible the world which it is itself a part of; a sort of self sustaining loop. But only the mysterious reality allows there to be the world, usually experienced as around a body.There is the possibility of "seeing" more directly the bodyworld without the conditioning filter, which is a creation in a subtler form ideas and emotions, a definite improvement but still limiting reality.

We can admit more complication with the body having different bodies with more subtle material and perceptions and more subtle bodyworlds. Again all being sustained by reality and reality being limited by the body / bodyworld experience. As reality is creating / allowing all these levels of experience, without i,t everthing would disappear. So reality would seem to have the ability to withdraw to the point of creation in some form or to non creation where the formless cannot experience.

It would seem that what I am truely is not a story, nor a mental emotional filter, not a body nor the bodyworld which is experienced.I am that reality which can experience through its creation. I could speculate about forgetting this, or becoming indentified with the body / mind and the resulting bodyworld, but this is far beyond the minds possibilties.

So I am left with that I as reality I have accepted all the limitations to experience this bodyworld. I have also as reality in some way opened the possibility of reality recognising itself. This has created a situation of change, the body / mind attempting to remove obstacles, understand, move in a certain direction. In conclusion some type of jump of reality within it´s own creation to a point of it´s own choosing.

A slight investigation of the existence of the mind filter leads to a SURRENDER to reality as my fundamental nature.

Proper mind candy that. Let's reset.

This inquiry is about our identification, more or less, with a personified idea of ourselves as an autonomous being in the body.

For now, we are not looking at whether - in reality - there is an autonomous being in the body (or not).

No. First and foremost, we are looking at our identification with a PERSONIFIED IDEA of ourselves as an autonomous being in the body.

It is the IDEA that is the illusion. This is what we are cracking. That we have become an IDEA.

Who gives a shit about reality? Reality is reality, it ain't going anywhere.

Walk with this for a bit, let it in for a while, share when you're ready.

With warm wishes,
John
"The more he looked inside, the more Piglet wasn't there." - A.A.Milne

Author, The Faun's Apprentice - see on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fauns-Apprenti ... B01AR2B63U

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Nigeluzito
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Re: A jump to truth.

Postby Nigeluzito » Sun Jun 28, 2020 11:22 am

Fine.

Thanks.

Returning to the filter , built of learnt ideas and emotions its only existence, is that given by belief in it.

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s-p-a-c-e
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Re: A jump to truth.

Postby s-p-a-c-e » Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:27 pm

Returning to the filter , built of learnt ideas and emotions its only existence, is that given by belief in it.

Briefly, for you, to what does self refer?

Thank you,
John
"The more he looked inside, the more Piglet wasn't there." - A.A.Milne

Author, The Faun's Apprentice - see on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fauns-Apprenti ... B01AR2B63U

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Nigeluzito
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Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2020 2:46 pm

Re: A jump to truth.

Postby Nigeluzito » Mon Jun 29, 2020 5:46 pm

I have been looking at the question of self today.

I don´t find a concrete self to identify.

A kind of fluid sensation / assumption changing with circumstances and enforced by language requirements.


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