Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

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CUTTaRUGG
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Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby CUTTaRUGG » Wed Jun 10, 2020 7:49 pm

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this?
My understanding is that the self is an ego program that is evolved over 200000 or so years as a security mechanism to keep us alive in a dualistic world of dangerous animals and "other" beings. The ego is an illusion over the innate self which is consciousness, raw, passionate, silent. The self is a label applied by ego and can be dismantled.

What are you looking for at LU?
I'm looking for guidance to help me focus and see my liberation through. I want to ask questions of my parts and to get to real answers that can unlock my freedom from suffering. Specifically, my suffering of insomnia for 30+ years. The parts that keep me up or wake me up want my safety, but I have tried everything under the sun to give them love and assurance that I will be okay, but the trauma is so deep that I need a deeper level of letting go. I'm looking to let go.

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
Questions that will challenge me. Questions that will unlock aspects of my psyche that have been walled off for protections sake. I have read the first few stories of Gateless Gatekeepers and listened to interviews on YouTube from LU. I expect to be pushed in a way that I'm avoiding or unable to see.

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?
6 years ago a 10-day silent vipassana unlocked childhood trauma and instigated weeks of insomnia. I spent a year getting my ability to breathe through my nose back without panic attacks. I began seeking nervous system education and this led me to trauma work. Working with Patrick Dominguez, we did brainspotting, core transformation, havening, EFT and other techniques to heal my wounded relationships with Jungian psychological parts. This work led me to find Aaron Abke on YouTube and his videos on A Course in Miracles, The Law of Attraction, The Law of One and Mind Science busted open my brain and reignited my desire for spiritual liberation. I've watched no fewer than 200 hours of his content and been absorbed deeply in this work for 7 months, non stop. I meditate for 1-3 hours upon waking, then do qi gong & Tai chi. On opposite days I microdose and Practice Wim Hof Breathing. I'm doing Network Chiropractic twice a week and Rolfing once every two weeks. I lead a men's circle on Wednesday nights and I have a vlog about my healing journey: Healing, it's a thing (HiT) - VLOG: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... u2YDWV3o0Y

I want to cross the gate, sleep deeply, dream clearly and live healthily. I then want to help others reach their version of their freedom.

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self?
9

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Ilona
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Re: Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby Ilona » Wed Jun 17, 2020 6:23 am

Hi cuttarugg, welcome to the forum. I hear you, enough of seeking! It’s quite an impressive list of practices you shared here.
We can have a conversation and see where it takes you.
However, this is not a promise, that your sleep cycles will regulate and lifestyle of living healthy is going to become default. This is about seeing what is as it is. That means seeing all patterns as they are and letting them run as they do.

Dealing with trauma may take a long time and this inquiry is not about that. ( I offer private sessions and can work with that too) this forum is about seeing that there is no separate self, as you think there is. Seeing that helps to unhook from all kinds of beliefs and patterns, but it’s not a door to happy ever after.

If that is ok with you and you are ready to end seeking, we can proceed.

To end seeking, let’s get clear, what is that you are seeking for precisely?
What do you expect that should happen?

Love.

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CUTTaRUGG
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Re: Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby CUTTaRUGG » Fri Jun 19, 2020 3:16 am

Thank you Ilona. I understand that the door is not a cure all.

I get that I am not my ego. My current understanding is that my soul is my consciousness/awareness and that is eternal and cannot be destroyed. But is that not my "self"?

I would like to know more about the concept of "no separate self".

Thank you,
Brandon

(PS, I'm headed out of data/cell range for 4.5 days backpacking tomorrow morning, so I may be delayed in my response, but I eagerly await)

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Re: Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby Ilona » Fri Jun 19, 2020 6:09 am

Hi Brandon,
Let’s explore. It’s great that you are going on backpacking trip and I hope this messge will get to you before you are out of reach.

When in nature, watch and observe aliveness. There is aliveness showing up as all different forms: trees, grass, birds, insects, animals, human.. is there a separate aliveness inside your body running independently from aliveness of animals and trees?
Is aliveness divisible or is it one aliveness? Is life happening to trees, to animals to humans or AS these forms and functions?
Are you outside of life looking at it?
Take words aliveness, life, nature, source energy, god, beingness, awareness and see how they point to the same.
Is it possible to be a separate self? Separate from what?

Have fun exploring!

Love.

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Re: Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby CUTTaRUGG » Thu Jun 25, 2020 7:38 pm

I explored your questions throughout the past week and I found much resonance in the deep forest. I took a wonderful dose of mushrooms to deepen my connection and found my body fully absorbed/connected to the earth, but days later, something is holding me back from deep integration.

Is life divisible By separate objects or one aliveness?

Everything is connected and interwoven and has been moving since the beginning of time

Is life happening to trees and grass or AS these forms and functions?


life is moving through me as it is moving through a water and the trees and grass. The water and rock or lower densities but still life is moving through it.

Am I outside of life looking at it?

Sometimes I feel like my energy isn't large enough to impact someone on the other side of the planet. and this seems to be proof that things are disconnected. But if everything is interwoven then currently imperceptable impacts could be traced between absolutely everything. But something holds me back. I'm expecting to feel some sort of elated connection to everything. It's seems my expectations are impacting me more than connectedness.

Do aliveness, God, source energy, life, nature, beingness, awareness... How do they point to the same?

All is God; how could something that God made not be God? I get this feel very strongly about it and my chest as a conviction. but it also feels like part of me desperately wants to believe this and still questions at some level. These parts are fighting for center stage puppeteer on my performance of life.

Is it possible to be a separate self? Separate from what?

I conceptually understand that I am the source energy, same as you, same as the ground. But, on mornings like today, where I went to bed exhausted after a huge day of growth work, I woke up at 5:45am unable to go back to sleep. My alarm is set for 8:30 and I have nothing important to do today. I feel exhausted, exasperated and after 30 years of resurfacing insomnia, effectively, separate from peace.

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Re: Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby Ilona » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:31 am

Thank you for reply. Hope you had a good sleep last night and are well rested.
Everything is connected and interwoven and has been moving since the beginning of time
Let’s look closer at this. What this statement says is that all parts, all forms are interconnected and are moving together. But it’s like saying that this piece of wind that is moving a tree is connected to that peace of wind that is moving my hair and it’s interwoven with the wind in Australia.

How many winds are there? Are winds separate from each other but connected somehow? Or is it one wind? One energy, one element?

So when you look at a form, any form, you can see and describe it’s form, you can see it’s function too. But there is essence that all forms are permuted by. It’s one life showing up as forms, one aliveness that expresses as forms. And when we look at a thing it seems a finite object and we don’t see the essence of it. We look at form and see the form. Look at the essence. Look at your own sense of being. Knowing that I am. That knowing, being aware, is what shows up as all the forms.

Is there a colour without knowing of it? Look around, is there sound without knowing if it? The sound and knowing of it is one and the same happening.

Then it’s seen, that life is no longer moving through you, but as you. As water, as grass, as everything. Life is. Forms are names.

What do you notice? Is there one aliveness or many?

Love.

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CUTTaRUGG
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Re: Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby CUTTaRUGG » Mon Jun 29, 2020 10:49 pm

On the surface (of this planet) there seem to be many winds, generated by the air pressure, temperature, moisture etc but all of those things/factors seem to be intricately connected to everything else in this biosphere. But what about beyond the planet? Does the fluttering of a butterfly's wings or the exploding of an atom bomb here have any connection to the churning of gasses inside of the Star Alpha Centauri? If it all is connected, it is likely all one substance, manifesting through each and every "thing". Some call this substance Love, or God. From the Law of One teachings, I recognize it as both.

I'm confused by your statement

"We look at form and see the form. Look at the essence. Look at your own sense of being. Knowing that I am. That knowing, being aware, is what shows up as all the forms."

The "being aware" is the forms? I was thinking of forms as labels (ego generated "separation" for survival/procreation purposes). Wouldn't being aware be more of the essence? The soul? The connection to everything?

I notice many alivenesses, but my heart hopes they're all connected. I don't have the visceral sense of it yet.

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Re: Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby Ilona » Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:06 am

Thank you.
On the surface (of this planet) there seem to be many winds, generated by the air pressure, temperature, moisture etc but all of those things/factors seem to be intricately connected to everything else in this biosphere. But what about beyond the planet? Does the fluttering of a butterfly's wings or the exploding of an atom bomb here have any connection to the churning of gasses inside of the Star Alpha Centauri? If it all is connected, it is likely all one substance, manifesting through each and every "thing". Some call this substance Love, or God. From the Law of One teachings, I recognize it as both.
Yes, that’s the understanding, all is one. One that shows up as many.

But understanding is not enough, there needs to be knowing, a recognition. There needs to be a connection with your own sense of beingness.

So focus in the sense of aliveness. The knowing that you are. Keep the focus there, what is that? What is here underneath all words and labels? What you think you are is in the mind level, in concepts about concepts. But look what is here besides the mind.
This video may help
https://youtu.be/LXrfQqvwIcU

Love.

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Re: Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby CUTTaRUGG » Thu Jul 09, 2020 7:57 pm

Sorry for the delayed response Ilona. I dove right into your video when you sent it over a week ago. I've watched it 3-4 times and each time, I'm able to drop more into the space of noticing energy showing up as all things. I conceptually have accepted that all things are one energy manifesting is different forms.

I tried to post this and my password didn't work for a few days. Then I ran into some serious complications in my life. My partner lied to me about sexual history and my nervous system freaked out. I tried to "be with" all the sensations coming up for the next few days and continued my many health practices (tai chi, running, working out, meditation, havening, wim hoff breathing, microdosing) and my nervous system has refused to go back into Parasympathetic. I'm on day 4-5 now and last night I couldn't sleep at all. Each time I fall asleep, an electrical shock bursts through my ears and body, and wakes me back up into a state of panic. This happened 200-300 times last night. I did many things to "be with" this challenge and love the messenger inside my body, but it wasn't until I opened "The More Beautiful World our hearts know is possible" a book by Charles Eisenstein and flipped right to where I'd left off months ago: Control.

I've known that my nervous system is trying to "control" my world to protect me. But I haven't seen it quite so clearly in large scale, cultural terms, as described in the book.

I'm not sure if I'm allowed to ask you questions, but my nervous system is threatening my health & sanity, so I'm exploring how to help this traumatized part release "control" over my system. If you have any thoughts, I'd be open to them or to any other line of questioning that can help me move forward with embodying my understanding of The Law of One (or however you refer to it).

Thank you,
Brandon

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Re: Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby Ilona » Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:32 pm

Dear Brandon.
Thank you for opening up. Yes, control is a big word and it seems that there is a lot to loose, if control is lost. Sanity included. And can you look at this this way: can you loose control that you never had?

Hypothetically you believe that you control the weather. And it seems to you that if you pray long enough you bring rain. And you live life believing that you are managing what is going in in your environment. And you think that you have to make things happen and you have a free will to do whatever you like with the weather. Only it doesn’t always go with what you want. Then you see, that hm, weather is happening by itself, I am not making it happen... so what is lost?
Similarly.. wanting to control is not controlling.
And you can check right now, just look around, what is it that you are actually controlling? What is not already and always happening by itself?
Look at colours, sounds, sensations, thoughts, feelings, images, ideas, understanding, seeing.
Explore and write what you notice.

Also, it helps to remember, that whatever intense experience you are going through right now it will pass. It is here to play itself out and be seen. To be met. Deep stuff is coming up. And that can be allowed.
And trust that this is unfolding as it should. Perfectly and uniquely for you.

Love

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Re: Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby CUTTaRUGG » Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:56 pm

What am I actually controlling?

It seems that I have control over what I do in the next moment. I can choose to rub my belly or make jelly or do nothing when someone needs help. I do not control the basis of colors, unless I'm mixing paint, but the original color is set somehow. I control sounds that come out of my body and can stop others from making sounds.

I don't think I can control sensations. Those are generated outside of my understanding.

Some thoughts are seemingly under my control. Others are not. I can control myself to think 1+1=2 but I cannot get a song to stop playing in my head.

I can generate feelings of love for someone. I can generate anger my thinking about injustice. But do I control these feelings, thoughts, sensations? Only to a degree, there's a space beyond my control as well. I could say, I can control writing this sentence, but a bus could slam into me right now and stop my progress: out of my control.

Additionally, I "controlled" my country wide journey tonight to have a peaceful night in the national forest. As I was eating dinner outside I was thinking "what a great choice" and suddenly a herd of cows started moo'ing angrily and before I knew it they were converging on me and forced me into my van. I'm now stuck in my van with my cooking supplies outside surrounded by tons of territorial cows. Guess I'm not in control of my evening like I thought.

Giving up control that I never had is possible for my central consciousness, but my wounded protector parts (from Jungian psychology) are where my issues lie. I have a part that really want to control my experiences so I get good rest and am healthy. This part is warring with another infant part that wakes me up many times a night wanting to control my safety.

I was up the last two nights, for 5-7 hours of "being with the lessons that are being served to me" before reaching the limit of what I can take and reverting to taking Ambien to pass out. Waking just a few hours later, my nervous system is hyper aroused and I feel like a horribly shaken child.

What to do about the subconscious trauma-afflicted parts that run so much of my physical experience of life?

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Re: Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby Ilona » Wed Jul 22, 2020 9:32 am

Thank you very much for describing your experience. It’s funny, that cows came and spoiled all the plans for a peaceful evening. A little adventure.
Can you take a closer look at how controlling happens.
Do you know what idea comes before it comes?
Do you choose what happens in the future?
Is planing something makes it happen?

Is wanting to control and actual control the same?
And what is claiming ownership of doing something?
Let’s say 2+2=4, can you say it = 7 instead? Is saying = 4 an automatic, learned concept? If so, who owns it?

Explore this and get back to me.

Love.

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Re: Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby CUTTaRUGG » Thu Jul 23, 2020 5:10 pm

There's a moment before trying to control something where my system says "I can have an impact on this situation". Planning something doesn't necessarily make it happen but it gives better odds that it will.

There is a part of me that believes that I can control the stakes of a situation, the odds. For instance, if I could choose a professional racecar driver or a 15 year old boy to enter a race, I would choose the racecar driver to "control" my odds of victory. This is how my system sees life. It says, if I put a bunch of attention and focus on this situation then my chances of survival will be higher. Unfortunately, my parts don't understand that tension actually makes me less likely to live a healthy happy life and survive for the long term. I would love to be able to convince these parts to let go of control. But that sounds like committing suicide to them. These are triggered responses. One or more kept me up all night again last night and my body is now in mania again today...

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Re: Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby Ilona » Fri Jul 24, 2020 5:58 am

Thank you for reply. Don’t worry, nothing and no one dies. Nothing that is real disappears. Only illusions are seen as that. So it is safe to explore and look at patterns that are operating.

I hear what you are saying, that you can choose which driver to has more chance of wining. But knowing what you know, in that situation, where you have to choose a driver, can you choose differently?
The question is, are you free to choose independently of situation and your conditioning?

Explore this today, any time you need to choose something, watch the process closely and see, can you choose differently (not in theory but in practice). What makes you choose what you choose? What influences the choice made? Is it possible to choose something that is not the best choice?

Can this moment be any different? What are you choosing right now?

Write what you notice.

Love

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Re: Fed up with seeking so... Seeking Guide... Ironic

Postby CUTTaRUGG » Sun Jul 26, 2020 6:21 pm

I feel like my choices are predetermined by things I have been conditioned through and things I've learned or seen. I feel like I'm making the best possible choice with the information that I have at the present moment. Many times my information is misguided or lacking data in difficult moments but I'm always doing the best I can.

I seem to have inspirations and ways that keep me acting the way that I act. I see a bird in front of me here, I could choose to kill that bird, but I don't because part of me doesn't want to. I could also drive my car off the cliff, but part of me wants to live. Some of these parts seem like wounded children and sometimes there seems to be something deeper. I assume this is my curiosity and maybe creativity from the soul/mind that incarnated here.

I seem to know this but still feel that I'm at choice in every situation and therefore feel the pressure of each choice. For instance, I was up all night again last night and kept trying different techniques to calm my nervous system and just couldn't figure out how to let go and trust that I'm doing my best and that I'm... "Needing to be up all night to learn a lesson" or something...ugh it's so painful and confusing.


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