Guide newcomer

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BeLikeWater
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Guide newcomer

Postby BeLikeWater » Mon Jun 01, 2020 8:00 pm

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this?
That the "I" will come to an end. Nothing will be gained, only everything (that is false) will be lost.

What are you looking for at LU?
Liberation from my false sense of self. It's really making my life a living hell and it just doesnt make sense as to why it should be that way - if nature is so beautiful, and life is expressing itself, and i cant see that AT ALL because i am constantly trapped in my mental prison, then there is obviously something wrong here

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
Just someone who could guide me through this, in a similar fashion as in the book Gateless gatecrashers. Someone who has "experienced" no-self and knows how to get someone else there. Other than that, not much else.

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?
So, i started seeking about a year ago, right before finishing up highscool. Had an LSD experience and it really opened up my mind, but it also sent me down the path of psychedelic delusional thinking. Then, 5 months ago, i randomly had a "born again Christian experience" after praying to "God" out of curiosity and so my experience of life has shifted quite a bit (not that i believe in God, i think it is just a subjective hallucination one can have).
Other than that, a bit of meditation and inquiry, but those only proved to make me "a bit more peaceful" and "altered my state of consciousness" which i dont really care about. Also, New age books, which i have since thrown in the thrash, since i have learned what the "real awakening" is about and that it is not about ascending into a different dimension or feeling ecstatic/blissful all the time.

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self?
10

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adamrenton
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Re: Guide newcomer

Postby adamrenton » Wed Jun 03, 2020 11:02 am

Hello there!

My name is Adam and it will be a great pleasure to guide you through this process. Are you ready to rock? :)

Sending Love!

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BeLikeWater
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Re: Guide newcomer

Postby BeLikeWater » Wed Jun 03, 2020 12:41 pm

Yes, for sure!
Just saying in advance, it's currently the final exams so i might not be able to completely do this all the time, but ill try to as much as possible!

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adamrenton
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Re: Guide newcomer

Postby adamrenton » Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:38 pm

Great!

Not a problem. Can you tell me your name? It will help us communicate better.
Please read the text below and - whenever you're ready - write me back.

First the boring part:
To communicate in a nice, orderly fashion:
1. Please learn the quote function

Here is my posh acquaintance with some tips:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fAToDNh9hQ

2. I will ask questions in blue text. Like this:

Do kangaroos fly?

Simply highlight them separately, press quote and answer the question.

Yay! We're done with the boring stuff. Now the magical saga unfolds!

_________________________________________________________________________________

Image

This is the EPIC CHEST OF OPENNESS.
Let's put everything in it. That means - any expectations, opinions, religious dogma, science - even Jesus and Buddha will fit in (it is THE epic chest after all).

After that - I'd like you to:

- STOP watching any material related to spirituality
- post regularly (if you won't be able to post in 3 days time and more - let me know)

Some of those may seem harsh - but believe me - through consistency and unfiltered inquiry - we will kick butts like a ninja.

_______________________________________

A major point in this inquiry is to know what is the difference between our DIRECT EXPERIENCE and the process of MIND LABELING. We won't go far without knowing the difference.

Here's an explanation (which we will back up with an exercise):

There is a cup on a table. We pick it up.

1. We notice the mind labeling it.
"It's a nice cup", "The cup is cold/warm to the touch", "The cup is heavy/light" or even "This is a cup".
Mind might even label some other things in the room and weave stories centered around them.

Those descriptions are what we call: MIND LABELING.

2. Now - let's put the stories aside.

We notice the sensation of holding - what mind calls "a cup". We notice the shifting colors, tap on "the cup" and listen to the sound it makes.

In this instance we focus on: sensation, hearing, smelling, tasting, looking (sight). Any thought emerging - regardless of its content - is just a THOUGHT.

This is an experience without the thought story. We don't go into the mind but stay with the DIRECT EXPERIENCE.

_____________________

Here's the exercise:

Take some object and use it the same way. First notice the MIND LABELING and describe the thoughts which emerged. Then describe the same thing using DIRECT EXPERIENCE.

Have fun!

Adam

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BeLikeWater
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Re: Guide newcomer

Postby BeLikeWater » Wed Jun 03, 2020 5:34 pm

Take some object and use it the same way. First notice the MIND LABELING and describe the thoughts which emerged. Then describe the same thing using DIRECT EXPERIENCE.


Ok, so it just so happened that I had a cup beside me and i noticed a couple of things whilst doing this exercise:

1) Right before picking it up, it was almost like the "Tei" character (oh, that's my name btw- Tei) was mentally preparing to pick it up ("ok, you should wait a couple of seconds to pick it up"). The "Tei" character even said ("3, 2, 1, .. PICK IT UP!") and so "I" went forth and picked it up. "I" also tried saying ("3, 2, 1, .. PICK IT UP!") and DIDN'T pick it up. The mind came up right after that and was like "You are so stupid, why didn't you pick it up?? Ok, next round... 3,2,... "
When the cup was being picked up/held up in the air, there was the thought of "Tei" in the mind (a guy with black hair, caucasian..). This thought was also there as i was preparing to pick up the cup.

2) Whilst the cup was being held up (it was a heavy cup), the mind was constantly rolling ("This cup is so heavy, oh gosh, just drop the cup, you cant hold it for much longer, OOh look at that, there's some lemon juice in the cup, and hmm, the shape of the cup is pretty cool" and so forth).

3) When i did the exercise of seeing what is happening in direct experience, there was a noticing of the fact that the SENSATIONS, SIGHTS, AND SOUNDS are ACTUAL whilst the mental stories are fiction and are not as real as the actual experience of holding a cup. "I" moved the cup around in the air with my hand from the left and right and it seemed as if the cup was just kind of moving itself.. but "I" had to tell myself that it is moving by itself, otherwise it felt as if the cup was being moved by someone. Just like right now if there is an awareness of this moment and of what is ACTUALLY happening (sounds, sights etc), it does seem as if the typing is happening by itself, but there has to be a constant REMINDING from "Tei's" or "someone's" part that this is so. So i dont fully believe things are happening by themselves, it's more of a theory that i have accepted as true, since i have read this on these threads.

I hope i am not skipping ahead and if i am, i would be glad if you told me i am.

-Tei

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BeLikeWater
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Re: Guide newcomer

Postby BeLikeWater » Wed Jun 03, 2020 5:35 pm

Oh, and I will not read any spiritual books/listen to teachers whilst doing this process.

-Tei

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BeLikeWater
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Re: Guide newcomer

Postby BeLikeWater » Wed Jun 03, 2020 8:13 pm

Oh and also, the cup had "Coca cola" written on it, so i said in my mind "i must lift up coca cola i mean, uhh, the cup" and so this made me realize that it doesnt really matter whether i call the ACTUAL cup Coca cola or " a cup" i mean those are just concepts/labels that get sticked onto the ACTUAL cup so it wouldnt really matter what i call the cup - i could as well call it a tree or an "apple"

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adamrenton
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Re: Guide newcomer

Postby adamrenton » Thu Jun 04, 2020 9:42 am

That's very nice Tei!

Do you understand and SEE the difference between Mind Labeling and Direct Experience?

This is step is very important. We look at every aspect of our lives from those two points. It is paramount.

If this whole thing is still vague - I have all sorts of steps to make it clearer.

Good Job my friend!

Adam

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BeLikeWater
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Re: Guide newcomer

Postby BeLikeWater » Thu Jun 04, 2020 10:37 am

Well, yes, the mental labelling is a fiction, whereas the real cup/lamp whatever that may be is ACTUAL and direct experience (which is actual) is different from mental labelling.

-Tei

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adamrenton
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Re: Guide newcomer

Postby adamrenton » Fri Jun 05, 2020 2:38 pm

Ok! Let's dive deeper dear Tei!

First thing I want you to know is that - from this point forward - we will inquire into the nature of our experience using DIRECT EXPERIENCE and seeing the stream of THOUGHT CONTENT.

DIRECT EXPERIENCE will always point us to the reality of what is here.

THOUGHT CONTENT is just a stream of stories.

Using the difference between those two aspects - we can dismantle BELIEFS.

What are BELIEFS you might ask?

BELIEFS are simply thoughts which are not questioned and looked at with a sharp-edged scrutiny.

For example: Our early belief in Santa Claus. There was supposedly a guy - wearing some fancy costume - coming down the chimney and putting stuff under our Christmas Tree.
One day - after some random event (which put the validity of Santa Claus into question) - we got suspicious.

After hitting our folks with our Terminator Stare and refusing to eat breakfast - our questions got answered.

An intense period of fear, sadness and anger came. Afterwards we were able to forgive our folks for this story and say bye-bye to the belief.

Santa Claus was real no more. His case was Claused (I'll show myself out).

Knowing that - we can look at beliefs and use our "magnifying glass" to see them in reality.

________________________________________

To make it even clearer:

Here's an exercise that I would like you to try as many times throughout the day as you
can. Label daily activities simply colour/image, sound, smell, taste, sensation, thought.

So for example, when having breakfast, become aware of:-
Seeing a cup, simply= image/colour
Smelling coffee, simply = smell
Feeling the warmth of the coffee cup, simply = sensation
Tasting the coffee, simply = taste
Hearing the spoon stirring the coffee, simply = sound
Thought about drinking the coffee, simply = thought

Just break down daily activities into these categories (which are all Actual/Direct
Experience) and report back how you go.

Keep on rockin'!

Adam

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BeLikeWater
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Re: Guide newcomer

Postby BeLikeWater » Sat Jun 06, 2020 12:35 am

Ok, I tried doing the exercise whilst i was on the way to the store and there seemed to be moments where things were kind of happening on their own - sound, walking, thoughts,...

I also noticed that mostly, there was thoughts. For example, even if a sound was heard (for example a bird singing), there always seemed to be a thought behind that sound, so mostly i was just labeling "thoughts".

I also tried switching whilst walking to "thought" and "walking happening" and it was obviously distinct - one was actual, the other was the IMAGE/THOUGHT of walking. Even right now as im typing, i mean it is hard to be aware whilst typing or rather i am noticing more and more that typing is just happening (i dont know what i wrote this sentence lol, it was indeed hard because it seems like some "me"/"I" has to think in order for writing to happen.

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adamrenton
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Re: Guide newcomer

Postby adamrenton » Sat Jun 06, 2020 4:49 am

Ok, I tried doing the exercise whilst i was on the way to the store and there seemed to be moments where things were kind of happening on their own - sound, walking, thoughts,...
That's good. Thank you for taking the time with it.

Please break down 3 activities in the way shown before:

Seeing a cup, simply= image/colour
Smelling coffee, simply = smell
Feeling the warmth of the coffee cup, simply = sensation
Tasting the coffee, simply = taste
Hearing the spoon stirring the coffee, simply = sound
Thought about drinking the coffee, simply = thought

Take care Tei! :)

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BeLikeWater
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Re: Guide newcomer

Postby BeLikeWater » Sat Jun 06, 2020 12:38 pm

Ok, I did it.

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adamrenton
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Re: Guide newcomer

Postby adamrenton » Sun Jun 07, 2020 2:04 am

Great! Could you post it here? That way it will be easier for us to find every aspect clearly :)

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BeLikeWater
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Re: Guide newcomer

Postby BeLikeWater » Tue Jun 09, 2020 12:06 am

Ok so,
I'm not really sure what to write, i mean I did the process step by step and basically what i noticed is that whilst drinking the coffee (in my case water), the thought of some Tei (my face) was there and there more awareness if this thought as opposed to tastin
So, the direct experience of drinking/looking/touching the cup/ was muddled up by thoughts.


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