I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

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KiwiKen
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Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby KiwiKen » Mon May 11, 2020 4:16 am

Paying attention only to the pure sensations, without relying on thoughts or mental images:

Can it be known how tall the body is?
No, I'm not able to know how tall my body is
Does the body have a weight or volume? In the actual experience does the body have a shape or a form?
When I first looked at this question I thought yes it does have weight but doing the exercise I examined whether the sensation was actually weight. It was just a feeling. I cannot determine its volume or shape.
Is there a boundary between the body and the clothing?
I cannot feel a boundary between the body and clothing.
Is there a boundary between the body and the chair?
No, I can feel any boundary between the body and the chair.

I
s there an inside or an outside?

If there is an inside - the inside of what exactly?

If there is an outside - the outside of what exactly?
For me, there doesn't seem to be an inside nor an outside.
What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to?
The biological form that seems to be carrying my Consciousness around. I say appears because I think that this consciousness will disappear when the body dies. Of course, we can say that it is because of identification with the body that we think it is a vessel.
What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?
The experience is an interpretation by the brain of information it receives from the 5 senses. So when you ask me what is the "ACTUAL" experience of the body, I may be misinterpreting what you really mean?

Still moving house for my daughter so I will get onto the other exercises tomorrow. However, I suspect you will have something to say about today's work to add to that..ha ha,

Much love

Ken

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KiwiKen
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Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby KiwiKen » Mon May 11, 2020 4:18 am

Hi Stacy,

This question had a spelling mistake so it should read
Is there a boundary between the body and the chair?
No, I can't feel any boundary between the body and the chair.

cheers

Ken

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Anastacia42
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Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby Anastacia42 » Tue May 12, 2020 3:46 am

Good evening

Okay, remember. ACTUAL Experience is one or more of 6 items listed in 2 previous posts in green. Please review those before replying.

What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to?

The biological form that seems to be carrying my Consciousness around. I say appears because I think that this consciousness will disappear when the body dies. Of course, we can say that it is because of identification with the body that we think it is a vessel.
What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?
The experience is an interpretation by the brain of information it receives from the 5 senses. So when you ask me what is the "ACTUAL" experience of the body, I may be misinterpreting what you really mean?
Which of the 6 items of Actusl Experience apply?

Can you see how much content of thought. conjecture & story is in your answer? Did you come to any of that through Direct Experience? No.


Remember what was observed a few days ago about where thoughts come from & whether you control them? Remember that when replying.

Remember to LOOK. We don't believe thinking. We want only what is Directly Experienced. No "interpretation."

It's a new skill & will take some practice.

There is only one of us here. Ken, one awareness. If you're not free. I'm not free. You can do this.

Much love ,
~ Stacy

"Not to know there is an alternative to being lost
in thought is to be a kind of prisoner."

~ Sam Harris

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KiwiKen
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Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby KiwiKen » Thu May 14, 2020 4:55 am

Hi Stacy,
We have been downgraded to level 2 so lots of catchup stuff been done over the last couple of day.
What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to?
It refers to my body as I perceive it to be it. right or wrong that's my answer
What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?
When I close my eyes there is no body. The experiences per se are made up.

Much Love...Ken

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Anastacia42
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Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby Anastacia42 » Thu May 14, 2020 2:21 pm

Good morning, Ken,

Glad to hear about Level 2. Hope you got your daughter moved okay.

Now, about Actual or Direct Experience. Do you remember the Apple Exercise?
However, is an apple actually known?
Hi Stacy, I may well be heading up a wrong path here but I can only speak from my understanding as it comes to me now.
The sensory aspects of an Apple and the thought about an Apple are known.
But as far as Apple being "known" this I think is the content within the thought about it?
That is exactly right. Specifically content of thought about some thing we labeled "apple," but just like in the movie, "The Matrix," there is no "apple," just as there was no spoon.

So, again, we have:

Actual or Direct Experience is only:

Seeing
Hearing
Feeling (Sensation, not emotion. Emotion is Sensation plus content of thought)
Tasting
Smelling
Thought Arising (Not content of thought. That is made up, has to be taught. Just like Santa Claus.)


I am not trying to convince you of anything. Remember that. I simply want you to LOOK. LOOKING is what will show you what is Actual Experience and what is not. Don't force it. Just relax and SEE.

Instead of SEEING Actual Experience, we believe the mind, the content of thought and that takes over - until we relax and LOOK.
~ Stacy

"Not to know there is an alternative to being lost
in thought is to be a kind of prisoner."

~ Sam Harris

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Anastacia42
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Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby Anastacia42 » Sat May 16, 2020 6:34 pm

Hi Ken,

Still out there?
What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?
When I close my eyes there is no body. The experiences per se are made up.
This part above is correct.
What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to?
It refers to my body as I perceive it to be it. right or wrong that's my answer

Why is this part above any different?


Much love
~ Stacy

"Not to know there is an alternative to being lost
in thought is to be a kind of prisoner."

~ Sam Harris

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KiwiKen
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Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby KiwiKen » Sat May 16, 2020 9:51 pm

Morning Stacy,

Still here, was on the road all day yesterday. I'm posting in a couple hours.

Much love...Ken

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KiwiKen
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Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby KiwiKen » Sun May 17, 2020 12:30 am

Morning Stacy,

Our daughter is all moved in and we're enjoying the benefits of Level 2. I might even go out for a meal today. So lets see if I've got it this time.
What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?
Thoughts arising,
The cool of the wind blowing on me.
The sounds of Plumber working inside.
The smell of salt air.
What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to?
It is an attempt to describe the entity that is experiencing these sensations. It's also a memory that we have of the image we see in the mirror in photos etc.

Enjoy your weekend

Much Love Ken

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Anastacia42
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Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby Anastacia42 » Sun May 17, 2020 4:15 am

Hi Ken,

When I say 6 choices I mean those 6 words only. Nothing else is Actual Experience.

Do you see how you keep adding "content of thought"?
What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?
Thoughts arising
The cool of the wind blowing on me
The sounds of Plumber working inside.
The smell of salt air.
What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to?
It is an attempt to describe the entity that is experiencing these sensations. It's also a memory that we have of the image we see in the mirror in photos etc.
Soon we will LOOK for this "entity" and later we'll LOOK for "memory."

Are any of the following DIRECTLY Experienced or did someone have to teach you these?

Cool, wind, blowing, me.
Plumber, working, inside.
Salt, air.

Do these words above have any existence of their own? Or did you have to learn them?

We will revisit "body" later. Let's look at this right now:

Label-Reality Correlation

There is a belief that labels have a one-to-one correspondence with ‘reality’. But there isn’t. Just like it is a generally accepted belief that labels like ‘good’ and ‘bad’ are inherent characteristics of ‘things’. But actually, they are not.

When you look at the word label ‘GREEN’ , what is the actual experience?

Is the colour red ‘experienced’, or is the colour green ‘experienced’ as the label suggests?

Does the label ‘GREEN’ have a one-to-one correspondence with ‘reality’? Or does the label suggest something else other than what is here now (red colour)?

Is 'green' associated in any way with the experience of the colour red; or is green just a label that overlays the actual experience of red?

If the label ‘GREEN’ is replaced with the label ‘GOOD’ or ‘BAD’ , is the redness affected in any way as the labels suggests?

Does redness become ‘good’ or ‘bad’, or do the labels have no affect whatsoever on ‘reality’?


Let me know what is SEEN.

Much love,
~ Stacy

"Not to know there is an alternative to being lost
in thought is to be a kind of prisoner."

~ Sam Harris

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KiwiKen
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Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby KiwiKen » Mon May 18, 2020 5:25 am

Good Afternoon Stacy,

Cool, wind, blowing, me.
Plumber, working, inside.
Salt, air
Do these words above have any existence of their own? Or did you have to learn them?
These words don't have an existence of their own, I learnt them all.
When you look at the word label ‘GREEN’, what is the actual experience?
There is no experience per se, what it does is conjure up in the mind of an image of the colour Green
Is the colour red ‘experienced’, or is the colour green ‘experienced’ as the label suggests?
No neither Red nor Green is experienced
Does the label ‘GREEN’ have a one-to-one correspondence with ‘reality’? Or does the label suggest something else other than what is here now (red colour)?
It doesn't have a one to one correspondence with reality, what it is doing is trying to describe reality.
Is 'green' associated in any way with the experience of the colour red; or is green just a label that overlays the actual experience of red?
It has no association with the experience of Red
If the label ‘GREEN’ is replaced with the label ‘GOOD’ or ‘BAD’ , is the redness affected in any way as the labels suggests?
No, its Redness is not affected in any way.
Does redness become ‘good’ or ‘bad’, or do the labels have no affect whatsoever on ‘reality’?
These Labels have no effect on reality at all.

Much Love

Ken

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Anastacia42
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Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby Anastacia42 » Mon May 18, 2020 6:40 pm

Hi Ken,

How can you say you do not see the color red? I am seriously asking, not criticizing. I need to know why you don't see that red color on the word "green."

I have to ask . . . are you possibly one of those who experiences color blindness?

When you look at the word label ‘GREEN’, what is the actual experience?
There is no experience per se, what it does is conjure up in the mind of an image of the colour Green
Is the colour red ‘experienced’, or is the colour green ‘experienced’ as the label suggests?
No neither Red nor Green is experienced
Much love,
~ Stacy

"Not to know there is an alternative to being lost
in thought is to be a kind of prisoner."

~ Sam Harris

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KiwiKen
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Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby KiwiKen » Mon May 18, 2020 9:23 pm

Morning Stacy,

The question was
Is the colour red ‘experienced’, or is the colour green ‘experienced’ as the label suggests
I understood it as asking if looking at the label ie the word Red or Green is it experienced. I said no as it is only experienced when looking at an object with those colours.

BTW not colour blind, ha ha , partially deaf yes. Just ask my Wife.

Much love

Ken

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Anastacia42
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Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby Anastacia42 » Mon May 18, 2020 11:44 pm

Ken,

When you are looking at the letters in the color red spelling the word green you are looking at an object that is red… isn't that right?

Don't try to complicate this. It's very simple

Much love,
~ Stacy

"Not to know there is an alternative to being lost
in thought is to be a kind of prisoner."

~ Sam Harris

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KiwiKen
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Joined: Mon Apr 27, 2020 5:10 am

Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby KiwiKen » Tue May 19, 2020 12:41 am

Hi Stacy,

I'm really not trying to complicate things.

When you are looking at the letters in the color red spelling the word green you are looking at an object that is red… isn't that right? 
This is absolutely correct.

Much love

Ken

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Anastacia42
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Re: I'm retired from work, I want to retire from the Search

Postby Anastacia42 » Tue May 19, 2020 2:32 am

Hi Ken,

I think you get the point of this exercise, based on your answer to the last question:
These Labels have no effect on reality at all.
So, good. How about this.then?

Friend/Stranger

Bring up a thought about a character labelled "friend".
Then bring up a thought about a character labelled "stranger".

Compare these thoughts.

Is there a difference in these thoughts?

Is there a true difference or is it just different content of thought?

Now, bring up a thought about a character labelled "friend".

After that, look at a thought about the character labelled "me”.

Is there a difference?

Is there anything special about thoughts with the content "me-character"?



Look. See. Report what is found.

Much love,
~ Stacy

"Not to know there is an alternative to being lost
in thought is to be a kind of prisoner."

~ Sam Harris


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