unblur my vision

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RandomGuy7
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unblur my vision

Postby RandomGuy7 » Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:51 pm

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this?
My current intellectual understanding of this is that who I currently believe myself to be is only an idea, a thought which is the result of my upbringing and integration into society. However, this not my actual experience, only second hand information picked up from various sources.

What are you looking for at LU?
A clear seeing of what I am not. To learn by first hand experience that what I think myself to be is no more than a concept. I am looking to discover who I really am. Even if there is a price to pay for that knowledge.

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
To push me gently or knock me roughly if need be into the correct direction to see for myself what is ultimately true, and what is belief/concept.
I would like to see for myself clearly, that is all.

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?
Dozens of advaita / nonduality books over a decade or so...

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self?
10

Bananafish
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Re: unblur my vision

Postby Bananafish » Sat Mar 21, 2020 6:28 am

Hi RandomGuy7. :)

My name is Bananafish, one of the guides in this forum.
I'd be more than glad to be your guide.


Thanks for the detailed intro!

First, I'd like to ask if "discovering who you really are" is your
primary goal, i.e. an end itself, for you. Do you expect something more
than "discovering who you really are" will come as result of our
conversation?


Also, please tell me about the distance you are feeling
towards the above goal; why aren't you there yet, after spending time trying to
find it? What makes you feel it's not enough?


Looking forward to your reply. :)

Bananafish
I'm available for Skype or Zoom face to face conversation. Drop me a line and we could arrange
the date.
Email: swinganova@hotmail.co.jp
Website: https://en.modernkoanproject.com

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RandomGuy7
Posts: 12
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Re: unblur my vision

Postby RandomGuy7 » Sun Mar 22, 2020 12:29 pm

Hello Bananafish,

Thanks for being my guide.

Yes, my primary goal is to find out who I am.
I have no other expectations, this is a tall order in itself.
But if something else also comes along, I am open.


When reading books, or listening to talks, sometimes there is a feeling of coherency, as if things fall into place.
But it is nothing I could formulate clearly for myself, or put into words.

I used to indulge in this activity, but things grew scary lately.
I started distracting myself as best as I can, but even distractions do not work anymore as they used to.
Now I gathered my courage to move forward, and would be grateful for some guidance.

Random

Bananafish
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Location: Japan
Contact:

Re: unblur my vision

Postby Bananafish » Sun Mar 22, 2020 12:44 pm

Hi Random. :)

Nice to meet you!
Let's begin our inquiry now.


You seem to think that you don't know who you really are.
What makes you believe in that notion of yourself?


What if you already ARE that?
What comes up?


Please write freely.


Best regards,

Bananafish
I'm available for Skype or Zoom face to face conversation. Drop me a line and we could arrange
the date.
Email: swinganova@hotmail.co.jp
Website: https://en.modernkoanproject.com

Bananafish
Posts: 3631
Joined: Mon Dec 08, 2014 3:29 pm
Location: Japan
Contact:

Re: unblur my vision

Postby Bananafish » Sun Mar 22, 2020 1:20 pm

Hi again. :)

I noticed that some of the wordings in my previous post were not accurate.
Please let me rephrase the question "What if you already ARE that?" to
"What if you have known it from the beginning?"
I'm available for Skype or Zoom face to face conversation. Drop me a line and we could arrange
the date.
Email: swinganova@hotmail.co.jp
Website: https://en.modernkoanproject.com

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RandomGuy7
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:49 pm

Re: unblur my vision

Postby RandomGuy7 » Sun Mar 22, 2020 6:43 pm

Hello Bananafish,
You seem to think that you don't know who you really are.
What makes you believe in that notion of yourself?
If I get the question right, I should find out what makes me believe that I do not know who I am.
Well, so far all versions of who I think I am failed to stand up to simple investigations, leaving me emptyhanded.
Right now, if I were to provide an honest answer to the question "who are you?", I had to say "I do not know".
What if you have known it from the beginning?
Do you mean to suggest that this knowledge is readily available, but it is not noticed, or simply overlooked?
Or that I have known this all along, just ignored it in favor of seemingly more important things?
Yes, that is quite a possibility...

Random

Bananafish
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Re: unblur my vision

Postby Bananafish » Sun Mar 22, 2020 9:08 pm

Hi Random. :)

Right now, if I were to provide an honest answer to the question "who are you?", I had to say "I do not know".

Great. :)


And what are you, when you don't know anything about you?


What is previous to all knowledge about you?

In other words, what is THIS that is present, here and now?
Please describe freely what is before you, right here and now.


Don't complicate yourself, and try to describe it as if you were a
five year old child.

Do you mean to suggest that this knowledge is readily available, but it is not noticed, or simply overlooked?
Or that I have known this all along, just ignored it in favor of seemingly more important things?

Both. :)
I'm available for Skype or Zoom face to face conversation. Drop me a line and we could arrange
the date.
Email: swinganova@hotmail.co.jp
Website: https://en.modernkoanproject.com

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RandomGuy7
Posts: 12
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Re: unblur my vision

Postby RandomGuy7 » Mon Mar 23, 2020 3:11 pm

Hi Bananafish,
And what are you, when you don't know anything about you?
I have no idea.
Would not anything I answer be some form of knowledge about me?
What is previous to all knowledge about you?
Previous to any knowledge about what/who I am is that I am.
I know that I exists, even if it is not clear what it is exactly that exists.
In other words, what is THIS that is present, here and now?
Appearances/perceptions are present, that is the basis of knowing that I am.

Random

Bananafish
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Re: unblur my vision

Postby Bananafish » Mon Mar 23, 2020 9:00 pm

Hello, Random. :)

Would not anything I answer be some form of knowledge about me?

Bingo. :) So please tell me about you not from any knowledge about you.
How would you do that?

I know that I exists, even if it is not clear what it is exactly that exists.

Great! You don't know what it is. And still you know that "I" exists.

Is that "I" the same as the "self" that you have imagined to exist
separately from everything else?

Can "you" exist while not knowing anything about "you"?


(BTW, let me clarify my question any time it is not clear enough)

Appearances/perceptions are present, that is the basis of knowing that I am.

Great job, Random. :)
Is the separate "self" one of these appearances?


Where do all these appearance appear at?

Where do they come from, and where have they gone when they aren't
there anymore?


Warm regards,

Bananafish
I'm available for Skype or Zoom face to face conversation. Drop me a line and we could arrange
the date.
Email: swinganova@hotmail.co.jp
Website: https://en.modernkoanproject.com

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RandomGuy7
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:49 pm

Re: unblur my vision

Postby RandomGuy7 » Wed Mar 25, 2020 5:22 pm

Hello Bananafish,

Wow, so many questions at once.
Where do I begin now?
Anyway, let me try to sum it up...

I am nothing.
Literally I am no thing, not a thing.
I am that which allows things to be, in which they appear.
The body, the separate self and all objects are equally appearances. Content that appears in "I".
The arbitrary division "me / not me" thus becomes meaningless.
Identification with any particular piece of appearance turns out to be a mistake. It ends up creating a fake subject.

On the other hand, if I rely on appearances for knowing that I am, they somehow cannot be separate from me.
Also, I do not feel any distance between I and appearances.
As if appearances were an integral part of me when they are present.
That would in turn mean I am everything that appears. Things not only appear in me, but as me.


That was quite a mouthful, I am out of breath for now.
I hope it wasn't over the top...

Random

Bananafish
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Location: Japan
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Re: unblur my vision

Postby Bananafish » Thu Mar 26, 2020 12:16 am

Hi Random. :)

Beautiful answers!


Now, could you name that "I" in which contents appear?

You don't have to use conventional terms for that.
Be a poet, and describe it freely.


Warm regards,

Bananafish
I'm available for Skype or Zoom face to face conversation. Drop me a line and we could arrange
the date.
Email: swinganova@hotmail.co.jp
Website: https://en.modernkoanproject.com

User avatar
RandomGuy7
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:49 pm

Re: unblur my vision

Postby RandomGuy7 » Thu Mar 26, 2020 5:58 pm

Hello Bananafish,

Thanks for your encouragement, but becoming a poet was never too high on my bucket list...

I guess the most frequently used expressions are awareness or conciousness.
But putting labels on it are attempts to objectify the ultimate subject.

Random

Bananafish
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Re: unblur my vision

Postby Bananafish » Thu Mar 26, 2020 8:30 pm

Hi Random. Yes, I hear you about the objectification.

But would you try it anyway? I often tell people to do this to see how
clear they are in their understanding. Somehow I knew that this is
a good way to see it.


Best wishes,

Bananafish
I'm available for Skype or Zoom face to face conversation. Drop me a line and we could arrange
the date.
Email: swinganova@hotmail.co.jp
Website: https://en.modernkoanproject.com

User avatar
RandomGuy7
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:49 pm

Re: unblur my vision

Postby RandomGuy7 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:55 pm

Hello Bananafish,

Then it looks like I am not completely clear yet, and you will have to push me further.

My current understanding is that the "I" in which and as which all content appears is conciousness.
As one of my favorite authors put it: U=C
The universe is conciousness, conciousness is the universe.
In my own words this would be more like knowing is being, being is knowing.

Random

Bananafish
Posts: 3631
Joined: Mon Dec 08, 2014 3:29 pm
Location: Japan
Contact:

Re: unblur my vision

Postby Bananafish » Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:56 pm

Thank you!
Well, the thing is that, you DO sound original. :)
"knowing is being, being is knowing", nicely put!


Do you feel you are crystal clear that there is no separate
entity we call "self"?
I'm available for Skype or Zoom face to face conversation. Drop me a line and we could arrange
the date.
Email: swinganova@hotmail.co.jp
Website: https://en.modernkoanproject.com


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