Fear decreasing

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Nameless1
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Nameless1 » Thu Oct 08, 2020 3:22 pm

Hi Vivien,

I'm disappointed in myself for getting distracted after I finally was able to get logged back in; (thank you for your help there) I got caught up in some drama and also distracted by worldly fears, and for the past week haven't really sat and looked. I'm back, and hopefully won't get that distracted/pulled away from looking again.
How do you know this?
How do you know that Nameless won’t fight for her life?
How do you know that she won’t have enough desire to fight?
How do you know that she will be passive?
I do not know what I will do. I can not tell you what I will do in the next 5 minutes with nothing having changed. And, I have started noticing thoughts that show different scenarios of me in the future after imagined Realization that don't depict such doom and gloom if i were to change as a result of Self realization. So some fear is subsiding over the weeks of looking that show even if i fight less, it's still a more peaceful life. I really do want to know the truth of what i am and what is going on here, but i'm not sure that even if i saw it, i would know that i was seeing the Truth.
What is your proof that this is what is going to happen?
I have zero proof that not fighting for my life would not happen. I am not a psychic, I can not see what will happen in the future; that is clear to me. At this point, I think it's just the idea that it could happen, but now after looking, other, not so bad, scenarios are believed to be possible, too.
And when you say “I don’t like any of the possible ending” – who is that that doesn’t like it, you or Nameless?
Sometimes it seems clear that whatever is seeing what's 'on the screen,' has no judgments about what is being seen and so it's me that doesn't like any of the possible endings. And, then at other times, it appears that I, and whatever is seeing are the same thing...and it just keeps going back and forth like that. That's why I said earlier that even if the truth was staring me right in the face, i'm not sure that i would be able to recognize it as the ultimate truth. I guess i've not seen the Ultimate truth yet, so that's why i remain confused. Perhaps if the Ultimate truth was ever realized, something would know that, i don't know.

Who feels frustrated right now? When looking, there are just physical sensations present. When not paying attention to thoughts, there doesn't appear to be anyone...namely, Nameless, here. But what notices all of that? Sometimes there seems to be an unaffected observer, sometimes it appears Nameless notices this, and other time it seems like noticing is/was just happening so which is it? none of these? all of these---on some level?

Nameless...i feel like i want to change my name to: Confused

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Vivien
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Vivien » Fri Oct 09, 2020 3:52 am

Hi Nameless,

Thank you for your replies.

Let’s look for the one that needs to be protected.

At first, notice what is here now in reality / experience. Notice all the colors, shapes, sounds, tastes, smells. These are here, and happening. Also notice sensations, feelings and thoughts that might be present.

Which one of these are the one that needs to be protected?

Is there any color or shape that is presently appearing that needs to be protected?
Is there any sound that needs protection?

Or maybe it’s a sensation that needs protection?
Or a feeling, or an emotion?

Or maybe it’s a thought that needs protection?
Which thought? A verbal thought needs to be protected, or a mental image needs protection?

What is here now that needs to be guarded and protected?


Please spend several days investigating this. Notice anything that needs protection.

Vivien
The most profound discoveries arise from questioning the obvious.

Website: https://www.viviennovak.com/

Blog: https://fadingveiling.com/

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Nameless1
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Nameless1 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:45 pm

Hi Vivien,
Which one of these are the one that needs to be protected?
Is there any color or shape that is presently appearing that needs to be protected?
Is there any sound that needs protection?
The only shape that sometimes appeared to need protection was the shape of my hand, finger, arm, leg...but those labels are overlays--words labeling the shapes, so I get stuck on this one. If the shape changes, it means the bone is broken or dislocated...not ok in my mind. No sounds or colors need to be protected.
Or maybe it’s a sensation that needs protection?
No sensations need to be protected.
Or a feeling, or an emotion?
No feelings or emotions need to be protected.
Or maybe it’s a thought that needs protection? Which thought? A verbal thought needs to be protected, or a mental image needs protection?
It appears to me that some images in the mind and thoughts need to be protected, for instance: I get an image of a snake, I need to not forget that snakes are dangerous or i could get hurt. Or, being in front of oncoming traffic is dangerous--i could get hurt or killed. If i forget these thoughts I can be injured. By protected, I mean not forgotten, not forgetting the meaning of those words or images. Certain memories appear to help me not do certain things again that do protect me from harm or protect me from harming others emotionally.
What is here now that needs to be guarded and protected?
it appears that certain parts of this body needs protection in order to continue functioning properly or to live.Am I this body? It seems so. It's been seen before that i am not the body, nor do i have a body, but most of the time it feels like i am this body.

Nameless

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Vivien
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Vivien » Thu Oct 15, 2020 4:17 am

Hi Nameless,
.Am I this body? It seems so. It's been seen before that i am not the body, nor do i have a body, but most of the time it feels like i am this body.
The body is.
But where is the I that identifies itself to be the body?

Vivien
The most profound discoveries arise from questioning the obvious.

Website: https://www.viviennovak.com/

Blog: https://fadingveiling.com/

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Nameless1
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Nameless1 » Thu Oct 15, 2020 2:36 pm

Hi Vivien,
But where is the I that identifies itself to be the body?
Sometimes if feels as though it's in my head--middle of the head, somewhat behind the eyes, but mostly thoughts are present telling me, "right here, in this sensation or this location," but these are see for what they really are: thoughts. So, at this point, I can not find a location as of yet.

I have been sitting with this question this morning and I love this question. I would like to continue sitting with this question for at least a week, and I will check back in in about a week.

In gratitude,

Nameless

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Vivien
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Vivien » Fri Oct 16, 2020 3:22 am

I have been sitting with this question this morning and I love this question. I would like to continue sitting with this question for at least a week, and I will check back in in about a week.
Yes, please do so.
The most profound discoveries arise from questioning the obvious.

Website: https://www.viviennovak.com/

Blog: https://fadingveiling.com/

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Nameless1
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Nameless1 » Mon Oct 19, 2020 5:02 pm

Hi Vivien,
But where is the I that identifies itself to be the body?
I can only say that it seems like it is in the head area as the one that is looking or seeing, which seems to be awareness only. Although i said i loved the question...i feel frustrated right now b/c i can not locate anything really, b/c i don't know the truth, and b/c i keep coming across more and more 'information' related to 'spirituality and knowledge' and i know nothing for sure. even dali lama appears to be part of the beast system in this world...really disturbed right now.

Nameless

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Vivien
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Vivien » Tue Oct 20, 2020 2:59 am

Hi Nameless,
V: But where is the I that identifies itself to be the body?
N: I can only say that it seems like it is in the head area as the one that is looking or seeing, which seems to be awareness only.
And how do you know that awareness identifies itself as the body?
Where does this information coming from?
Does awareness make a statement ‘Hey, I am the one identifying with the body”?
Or is this just an unquestioned assumption which falls away under scrutiny?

How do you know that awareness is in the head?
Is this something that experience shows (literally), an awareness being inside the head doing things, or rather this is just a logical conclusion?

How do you know that there is anything inside the head looking and seeing?
Is there a looker/seer/doing inside the head? A real one? Or just an assumed one?

Can you see that this awareness-entity is just a fictional thought-story?

i feel frustrated right now b/c i can not locate anything really, b/c i don't know the truth, and b/c i keep coming across more and more 'information' related to 'spirituality and knowledge' and i know nothing for sure.
Of course that you don’t know anything for sure! That’s excellent news! :) And I am serious :)

This investigation is about questioning everything we know to see if they can stand up to scrutiny.
The more inquiry you do, the less knowledge can stand.
And this is what waking up about.
Waking up from the dream of your ‘knowledge’.
Which is nothing else than just a big web of conceptualization covering the real deal, the immediacy of experience, which doesn’t require any knowledge.
Since all there is to be known is directly, silently (wordlessly) known / seen. No thought is needed.

Vivien
The most profound discoveries arise from questioning the obvious.

Website: https://www.viviennovak.com/

Blog: https://fadingveiling.com/

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Nameless1
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Nameless1 » Fri Oct 23, 2020 2:46 pm

Hi Vivien,

I just want to let you know that I am sitting with these questions daily, but I would like to sit with them for some more time. I will get back with you within about a week. Thank you for understanding....I''m stuck in the same place and want to see if "i" can make some headway before responding.

Nameless

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Vivien
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Vivien » Fri Oct 23, 2020 11:59 pm

All right, thank you for letting me know :)
The most profound discoveries arise from questioning the obvious.

Website: https://www.viviennovak.com/

Blog: https://fadingveiling.com/

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Nameless1
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Nameless1 » Thu Oct 29, 2020 4:14 pm

Hi Vivien,
And how do you know that awareness identifies itself as the body?
Where does this information coming from?
Does awareness make a statement ‘Hey, I am the one identifying with the body”?
Or is this just an unquestioned assumption which falls away under scrutiny?
Awareness does not say anything. It just seems to witness, rather is always just here; it is here when a thought is noticed and it is still here when the thought disappears.
How do you know that awareness is in the head?
Is this something that experience shows (literally), an awareness being inside the head doing things, or rather this is just a logical conclusion?
I do not know where awareness is, it only seems like it is most of the time based on a logical conclusion.
How do you know that there is anything inside the head looking and seeing?
Is there a looker/seer/doing inside the head? A real one? Or just an assumed one?
Most of the time it seems like there is a looker, but there have a few times that it's been noticed--for a second or few seconds, that there is no looker inside the head, sometimes it was like it was seen there was no head in reality. I did this exercise with eyes closed mostly, but also tried it with eyes open.
Can you see that this awareness-entity is just a fictional thought-story?
It was seen a few times...again, just for a few seconds. Like seeing happens then immediately after that thoughts about what was seen or thoughts in general were noticed and it is these thoughts, language that creates the story of me. It's just really really frustrating to "think i have it, then 'I' don't have it." make sense? I did miss a few days of looking, i wish that wasn't true but it is. there is a part of me that knows this is the most important thing i can spend my time doing--this looking for the truth, but my actions don't match what i'm saying. :(

Nameless


Nameless

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Vivien
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Vivien » Fri Oct 30, 2020 5:35 am

Hi Nameless,
I do not know where awareness is, it only seems like it is most of the time based on a logical conclusion.
Exactly!
We make up all sort of imaginations and ideas about awareness. We even personify it, like here:
Awareness does not say anything. It just seems to witness, rather is always just here; it is here when a thought is noticed and it is still here when the thought disappears.
Here awareness is personified, made into an entity. It made into someone or something that is witnessing what is going on.

But what if there is no witness?
What if awareness is not an entity being aware of what is happening?
What if there is no awareness (as a noun)?
What if it is a verb (aware-ing)?
And what if there is no awareness + the aware-d as two things?
What if all there is the knowing of what is happening, but the words of knowing + ‘what is happening’ don’t point to two different phenomena, but rather the only one and same phenomenon there is?

It's just really really frustrating to "think i have it, then 'I' don't have it." make sense?
Yes, I understand you.

But if there is a thought that “I have it” and this thought is not seen to be only as a thought appearing, but rather taken to be something true and actual, then the illusion of a person having it appears.

There is no you to have it. Not even as an awareness.
Seeing of this can happen, but there is no seer who/what could see it.
i wish that wasn't true but it is. there is a part of me that knows this is the most important thing i can spend my time doing--this looking for the truth, but my actions don't match what i'm saying. :(
I’m sending you a private message.

Vivien
The most profound discoveries arise from questioning the obvious.

Website: https://www.viviennovak.com/

Blog: https://fadingveiling.com/

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Nameless1
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Nameless1 » Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:13 am

Hi Vivien,
But what if there is no witness?
What if awareness is not an entity being aware of what is happening?
What if there is no awareness (as a noun)?
What if it is a verb (aware-ing)?
And what if there is no awareness + the aware-d as two things?
What if all there is the knowing of what is happening, but the words of knowing + ‘what is happening’ don’t point to two different phenomena, but rather the only one and same phenomenon there is?
Yes, all of that has been seen---in the past, so there is a knowing of that, but perhaps I don't really believe it? And, I have not been looking daily, again, out of fear of NWO having much of my attention, fear telling me I NEED to think right now, and that is obviously believed b/c that is what I have been following most. I am aware of that fraction of a second of just raw sound...can't do it so much with sight, taste, touch or smell, before thought kicks in and starts commenting on what it just heard, but that isn't producing any lasting or permanent ....realization. The question just came to me again: Can I see that this focusing on fear of the future is not helpful to me, that time would be better spent seeing the truth so freedom from fear can be experienced? ....I can see this is true, but in the moments of every day, fear takes over. Who is it that could die? It's been seen before that no one was born, so there is no one that can die...but this body can feel pain...this is the circle i go through.

Nameless

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Vivien
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Vivien » Tue Nov 17, 2020 4:15 am

Hi Nameless,
Yes, all of that has been seen---in the past, so there is a knowing of that, but perhaps I don't really believe it?
If you need to believe in it that you are not seeing it. Do you need to believe that there is laptop in front of you, or you know it since you see it? No belief is needed to notice and see the laptop. You need belief only if you don’t see it. Than you have to rely on beliefs, otherwise its existence is self-evident.

It doesn’t matter if something has been seen in the past. It doesn’t matter at all. Why?
If I cannot SEE something RIGHT NOW, then I cannot see it.
It doesn’t matter if I saw it 5 minutes ago; if don’t see it right now, then I’m just believing in it.
Seeing happens moment by moment.

A memory of a past experience is NOT seeing.
That is just a thought, a belief in this very moment.
Seeing that there is no separate self is not a one-time event that we rely on the memory of it after that. That would be just another belief.

Seeing that there is no separate self can only ever happen NOW. And now. Can I see it now? And now? And what about now? And this moment? And now?
And, I have not been looking daily, again, out of fear of NWO having much of my attention, fear telling me I NEED to think right now,
Just look… fear doesn’t tell you anything. Fear cannot talk. Fear is a sensation. A sensation cannot talk. It has no mouth :)
You are mistaken thoughts for fear. Thoughts might talk about a fearful story… and if you take that story seriously, then the sensation called ‘fear’ can show up.

But it’s all thoughts. Can you see this?
You are afraid of a story… Can you see this?

Just notice how much repetition is there with this story… how many times in a day do you have the same thought again and again? And how many times have you had it in the last week? And the last month? And the last year?

Can you see that these fearful thoughts are recycled day-by-day, year-by-year, again and again, probably since childhood?
The content might change a bit, but the foundation of the story, the projection of danger and thus the fear remains?

This is a conditioned pattern playing itself our thousands of times (or maybe millions in a lifetime)… again and again…

This story is repeated again and again… and this is how suffering is built up. Thought by thought… suffering is created. Can you see this?

What would left of the fear if suddenly all your thoughts turned into the tweeting of birds?
What happens if you replace your thoughts with ‘blah-blah-blah’? Is there fear then?
Or fear is created by thoughts only? By one thought at a time?

Vivien
The most profound discoveries arise from questioning the obvious.

Website: https://www.viviennovak.com/

Blog: https://fadingveiling.com/

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Vivien
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Re: Fear decreasing

Postby Vivien » Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:50 am

I wrote a blog post why seeing can only happen now… and never as a memory

https://fadingveiling.com/2020/10/04/no ... -here-now/
The most profound discoveries arise from questioning the obvious.

Website: https://www.viviennovak.com/

Blog: https://fadingveiling.com/


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