Guided Self Inquiry

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Neel1234
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Re: Guided Self Inquiry

Postby Neel1234 » Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:15 am

When you suggest 'there is looking happening', what do you find performing that activity?
Well..there is this vague sense of "attention" flowing around and doing the looking.
If there an 'I' that could make the thoughts stops? Or change? Or has the ability to not be deceived by them / believe 'I' thoughts are true?
There's no "I" that could make the thoughts stop ,change or has the ability to not be deceived by them."I" itself is a part of the stream of thoughts.

:)

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Xain
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Re: Guided Self Inquiry

Postby Xain » Wed Apr 26, 2017 12:56 pm

Well..there is this vague sense of "attention" flowing around and doing the looking.
So there are two clear things.
There is 'what is seen' and there is 'sense of attention' doing the seeing?
There's no "I" that could make the thoughts stop ,change or has the ability to not be deceived by them."I" itself is a part of the stream of thoughts.
Yes, it is.

Just consider this:
Would 'sense of attention' as you mentioned above also be something that's in the stream of thoughts.
Or can you FIND it in experience.
What seems more clear? (And why)

Xain ♥

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Neel1234
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Re: Guided Self Inquiry

Postby Neel1234 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 11:20 am

Would 'sense of attention' as you mentioned above also be something that's in the stream of thoughts.
Or can you FIND it in experience.
What seems more clear? (And why)

hmm.. This attention is like "focused looking. So it is basically looking itself. Attention is just a label given to the action of focused looking. So yes, it would be more accurate to say "Attention" is a label that is in the stream of thoughts . It cannot be found in direct experience. It is more clear to say that "attention " is just a label given to the action of looking when it gets fixated on certain things .

Just to recap :

From direct experience : (Trying to get an accurate sense of "me" in real time)


- It was not found to be the inner voice/thoughts
- It was not found to be the " I" thought
- It was not found to be the "brain" Even though the brain is responsible for many cognitive functions and rendering certain information, the "I" is not the brain. It is a thought formed in the brain. So any thought of "I" being "the brain" is just another thought.
- The feeling of "I" am..(this aliveness) is a result of sensations , thoughts, feelings/emotions, none of which can be "me"
- Any idea of a "me" or an "I" is just another thought and not a real thing.
- Any idea of "I" being consciousness/awareness is just another thought and not direct experience.
So in conclusion, there is no real self that is experiencing this reality. I is merely a thought and nothing more. ( Hope this enquiry is in the right track :) )

:)

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Xain
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Re: Guided Self Inquiry

Postby Xain » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:15 am

the "I" is not the brain. It is a thought formed in the brain.
Whilst I would agree that medical science holds this opinion, and I would not argue that it is wrong . . . is it anything more than speculation?
Notice - This is still a subtle clinging to a belief that 'there is something separate here right now that is doing things'.
So any thought of "I" being "the brain" is just another thought.
Could 'thoughts are created by the brain' be just another thought?
Is it really any different from 'I am creating thoughts'?
Or is it possible for you, right now in your experience to determine the truth of this?
- Any idea of a "me" or an "I" is just another thought and not a real thing.
- Any idea of "I" being consciousness/awareness is just another thought and not direct experience.
Yes, although please don't get too hung up that 'Direct Experience' is some-sort of measure of the truth or 'real thing'.
It's only a useful pointer. A pointer for you to examine the experience being presented to you in the immediate moment.
So in conclusion, there is no real self that is experiencing this reality. I is merely a thought and nothing more. ( Hope this enquiry is in the right track :) )
It is!
But is there a 'real I' here right now on a track?
Is there an inherent self doing an enquiry right now? Was there ever?
Is there a 'real I' going to choose what to reply in a message?
Has there ever been a 'real I'?

Xain ♥

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Neel1234
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Re: Guided Self Inquiry

Postby Neel1234 » Sat Apr 29, 2017 9:16 am

Whilst I would agree that medical science holds this opinion, and I would not argue that it is wrong . . . is it anything more than speculation?
Yes."I" not being the brain but is a thought formed in the brain implies a doer of things.
Could 'thoughts are created by the brain' be just another thought?
Yes absolutely. It's not that different from saying " I am creating thoughts".
Or is it possible for you, right now in your experience to determine the truth of this?
No it's not possible to determine the truth of this in an experiential way.
But is there a 'real I' here right now on a track?
Is there an inherent self doing an enquiry right now? Was there ever?
Is there a 'real I' going to choose what to reply in a message?
Has there ever been a 'real I'?
No. There's no real "I" right now that is on track.
There was no real inherent self doing this inquiry. There never was one.
There's no real "I" choosing what to reply to these messages.
There never was a real "I". :)



:)

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Xain
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Re: Guided Self Inquiry

Postby Xain » Sat Apr 29, 2017 9:34 am

How confident are you of the realisation?
How do you feel?
Is there any confusion in any areas, or do you have questions at this point?

Xain ♥

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Neel1234
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Re: Guided Self Inquiry

Postby Neel1234 » Sun Apr 30, 2017 10:40 am

I'm pretty confident of this realisation.

Having sorts of mixed feelings. All along the thought of "I" being the body etc was very strong. Now there's a parting of the clouds and the identification with the body and mind is getting weaker. As far as feelings go, everything seems pretty much the same. This is most likely due to "me" battling with depression and anxiety for a long period of time . That's also why it was so easy to relate with the author of "The Power of now" on a personal level haha.
Is there any confusion in any areas, or do you have questions at this point?
Yup. So if there's is no inherent self, then what's perceiving all these sensations?

When considering the gaps between thoughts (moments of brief silence in the mind) , the perceiving is still happening.

So who's/what's aware of our thoughts,sensations etc?

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Xain
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Re: Guided Self Inquiry

Postby Xain » Sun Apr 30, 2017 1:56 pm

Many of the questions you are asking are beyond the scope of seeing 'no self' and the guidance via LU.
I will try to address them a little to assist you.
This is most likely due to "me" battling with depression and anxiety for a long period of time . That's also why it was so easy to relate with the author of "The Power of now" on a personal level haha.
Depression, anxiety and any other unpleasant emotions are something you can address as a separate inquiry. Generally, they don't change at all when realising 'no self'. Although it can be realised that there is no inherent self feeling these emotions, they are still there. We can say that these things are cause by a subtler belief that there is something 'here' which reacts to experiences or reacts to negative thoughts.
The good thing is that these things can be address with further guidance.
Yup. So if there's is no inherent self, then what's perceiving all these sensations?
There is much further too look at if the interest takes you.
Built within your question is the assumption of duality - That there are definitely two things, one perceiving and one being perceived. You inquiry would be to continuously examine this assumption.
As mentioned, objects in experience will be perceived 'at a distance' from a location where experiencing appears to be happening and this does not change with simply realising 'no inherent self', but this can be examined also in further guidance- There are many further realisations to be gained.
So who's/what's aware of our thoughts,sensations etc?
Would a conceptual reply satisfy you? Another belief to cling to?
Or would it be better to examine your question and realise the answer experientially? It is possible.
Maybe the question you are asking has an inbuilt error caused by language itself - That thoughts and language can only deal with separation, duality and things that have opposites by which they can be known by.

Since you appear confident, there are a further six questions I can ask as part of this process.
Here are the first three of the six questions.

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form (other than in the content of thoughts of course)? Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience and understanding. Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference (if anything) between now and before you started the guidance?

Xain ♥

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Xain
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Location: Everywhere and Nowhere

Re: Guided Self Inquiry

Postby Xain » Sat May 06, 2017 1:58 pm

Hi Neel

You haven't responded for a week now, so I am assuming you no-longer wish to be guided.
I am very busy now with other clients. If you wish to continue, please begin a new thread with another guide or message me privately with what you'd like to do.

All the best for the future
Xain ♥


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